Wondering how the strike by college teachers and librarians will affect your studies? The school year? Want to know what the main issues are in this dispute? The Star's online education forum is taking your questions and comments and we'll get more answers to you from Tyler Charlebois of the College Student Alliance starting again on Monday, March 20.
For up-to-date information, you can also check out www.collegestrike.com.
Q: Hi. What is the likelihood that the province will have college management take over teaching responsibilities? And is management qualified to teach most of these courses?
A: It is up to the individual colleges how to handle this issue, not the province; but as yet no decision has been made on using managers and replacement workers.
Q: Hi, my daughter is in a collaborative BscNursing program at Trent/Fleming in Peterborough. Parts of her year is being disrupted by the strike. How can she be guaranteed that her she will be able to meet her requirements to complete her year?
A: The colleges have guaranteed that no student will lose his/her school year because of the strike and are to provide more details next week. So stay tuned.
Q: Hey, I am a student of Ryerson University's collaborative Nursing (BScN) program and am currently at Centennial college site. I wanted to know if the semester would be extended for the same amount of time for which the strike lasted? Would the college teachers be teaching students properly in the same way they were teaching before the strike or will they be rushing through the content?
Our clinical placements require us to be in clinic for about 4-5 weeks, we almost wasted 2 weeks of our clinical placement due to the strike. In case of extended semester, would we still be still going to our previously scheduled clinical placements because some assignments are related to our experience in long term care facility.
What happens if I take summer courses with Ryerson university and the college semester gets extended, should I still apply for the summer courses with Ryerson, because the seats might get filled up!
My last question is: Are the teachers getting paid by the college while they are on strike, because it's a loss of students!
A: Colleges are to provide more details next week about how the school year is to be salvaged; otherwise, contact your college's academic vice-president for more details.
And no, teachers are not being paid during the strike. They receive a small strike pay from their union.
Q: Hello! I am a third-year college student, who is expecting to graduate in June. I have heard from many news reports that colleges are creating contingency plans, specifically targeted to graduating students first, then other students. Do colleges expect graduating students to finish their semester on weekends? I, like many other students, use my weekend to work. There is no way that I would be able to not work on the weekend and go to school. My weekend work pays for my gas, insurance, food expenses, as well as other necessary expenses. How is that fair that students would have to finish their classes on the weekend? When I chose to further my studies at a post-secondary institution, I agreed to do my schooling under the original terms: Monday to Friday with varying class times, NOT THE WEEKEND. Why should any student have to make up the time for something that is beyond our control. We did not ask for the strike. I understand that each college is working out a plan that is tailored to its students, but I do not think that any student should be forced to go to school on the weekend. I am concerned that work which has already been submitted, will not be graded appropriately. Have colleges discussed any method for grading students assignments or tests that have been submitted or have they discussed changing marking schemes for assignments or tests that have been missed due to the strike? If the teachers really cared about the students, they would not make it this difficult for us to finish our year. -A disappointed student.
A: Yours is a concern shared by many students. That said, no decision has been made as yet, but colleges are to roll out more specific details next week on their plans to make sure students don't lose the year.
Q: I have been accepted to York University and will be starting in September on the condition that I complete my college diploma. What will happen to my acceptance in the event this strike goes on longer than three weeks? WHY HASN'T THE GOVERNMENT STEPPED IN TO STOP THIS STRIKE?
A: That is a very good question. It's unclear what will happen for students who are transferring from college to university. We're hoping that universities make exceptions and look at the student and the grades that they have. I would confer with your college to make sure you are able to complete your program so that you won't have any troubles with the transition to university. I would consult your college program coordinator or the academic vice-president. Please note there is an announcement tomorrow (Tuesday, March 14) by the colleges regarding the school year, which may help clear things up for students.
The McGuinty government's position is that the colleges and teachers are big boys and girls, and they need to come back to the table on their own and hammer out an agreement. Currently, he says there's still time for the parties to get back to the table and get an agreement that works for everyone.
Q: Hi! As a parent with two boys at college, I would like to know if the strike lasts so that the students have to go in to May, am I expected to pay two more months of room and board? I also wonder about the jobs that they are supposed to start at the beginning of May? By the Q&A I been reading, it seem pretty simple to say we have never lost a semester because of a strike. All I know is nobody seems to give a hoot about the STUDENTS! I think the teachers & government are not worried about what may happen to students, like added costs and jobs. I think the teachers and the government should look to getting together and settle this strike instead off running to the PRESS and blaming each other. All I notice that was resolved so far was the government's 5 per cent tuition increase.
A: No decision has been made as yet to extend the school year.
Regarding added costs, what has been done in the past, is that for those students on financial assistance, allowances are made; colleges have on-campus financial assistance that is available. So students who are having trouble with finances and will have trouble after the strike is completed, they should go to their institution's financial office and apply for more funds to continue with the program.
Q: Hi, I have a question concerning the strike. I'm applying to the Book and Magazine Publishing post-graduate program at Centennial College set to start in September 2006. I had an interview/information session set for March 17th as part of the admissions process. I have been unable to reach the school. I was wondering if there's a way to know if this interview is still going to happen, or if it is cancelled if the strike is still on?
A: I would contact the program co-ordinator, or your key contact person. If you can't reach either, I would go to the vice-president, academic at the college and ask that question.
Q: Everyone keeps talking about what will happen if the strike "drags on." Now, there's talk about weekend classes, which will cause huge problems for many - if not all - college students. I know of myself and many others who will find it absolutely impossible to come in on a Saturday or Sunday for classes.
Does anyone have any idea what exactly is meant by "if the strike drags on"? How long does it have to go before these plans would come into effect? I know that nobody knows for sure what "these plans" are, but does anyone know how much longer things would have to carry on, before they would actually have to start executing some of these plans?
A: What they mean by "if the strike drags on," is if it reaches a point where the academic year is in jeopardy.
The next step - we're likely to learn something tomorrow (Tuesday, March 14) when the colleges are to make an announcement on the school year, if it will be extended, how students will graduate, etc. Each student has different circumstances at different colleges, depending on the program, so there won't be a province-wide solution for how things are going to be handled. It will go institution by institution, program by program, student by student.
Q: Hi! I'm a student in the combined Mohawk-McMaster nursing program. Part of my studies is currently on hold due to this college strike. I booked a flight for April 28 to attend a family function in Europe, way back in December '05 when there was a seat sale. My semester was supposed to be done by the end of April. Now, if the semester is extended because of the strike, who will reimburse me for the flight, because the ticket cannot be rescheduled, and it is not possible to get my money back. Travel insurance does not cover this. Thank you for any help you can give me.
A: It's my suggestion that you contact the dean or vice-president, academic, at your school to speak to them about this. It's an issue that needs to be looked at in more of an indiviual manner, and institutions are able to make special accommodations for unique circumstances.
Q: I would like to know how much notice the public will get after an agreement is made? If I go home for awhile, and hear that the strike is over, how much time do I have to get back to school?
A: The date that classes would resume, in the event of an agreement being reached, would be written in return-to-work protocol, and it would be a date negotiated by the parties and they would get the information out to students. There's no set time, i.e. one or two or three days' notice before classes resume.
That said, it's plausible that if an agreement is reached on a Friday, school would re-open Monday, or if it was mid-week they'd probably give one day's notice before students were required to return to class.
Q: I read on the OPSEU website that there will be information available for the media on Friday (March 10_ at 11:00. It said, however, that there will be an "update" on bargaining provided. If there is currently no bargaining going on, how can there be an update? And will this "update" be televised?
A: Tomorrow morning is an official update on the strike situation. And you're right, there is no bargaining going on between the two sides. As for it being televised, I'm sure one of the local news stations will cover it live.
Q: Can you please tell me how much money the provincial government is saving because of the college strike by OPSEU? Since there are no classes, does the provincial government still pay the colleges? If not, how much are they saving? If the provincial government is paying the colleges, how much are college management saving by not paying salaries?
If the union is forced back to work with legislation and the student year is saved, then is the real issue here how much money the McGuinty government and/or the college management can save before legislating OPSEU back to work? Please let me know and thank you in advance for your assistance.
A: The provincial government isn't saving any money; it has already invested its money in the college sector.
It's true, the colleges are saving by not having to pay out faculty salaries and benefits, but when the faculty do return to work, they'll be getting salary arrangements which will be retroactive to August 31, 2005, which is when their last contract expired. So, in essence, there's not much that's being saved so far by having a faculty strike.
Q: I am in the BSc Nursing Program at Cambrian College in Sudbury. Our class is currently finishing our preceptorship at local hospitals. I have been contacted by college management who state that they may hire another nurse to oversee our placements. Our current clinical coordinator is on strike. Is it legal for management to hire someone outside of management in order to complete our placements? I was under the impression that in a strike position, management are the only ones that can replace teachers if they have the same qualifications.
A: If that's the option the college is looking at, then it can do it. No one has said replacement or "scab" workers are not allowed.
From the outside looking in, the institution is probably trying to ensure that students graduate. You will have someone to monitor and audit, to do the clinical, so that you can be graded and finish the semester.
Q: My son is an international student in a program at Humber. Because of a job lined up when school is out, he is unable to stay past the current end of the year. Should the semester be extended, and he cannot stay, will he lose the entire term? Would he be entitled to a refund?
A: It's my suggestion that you, or your son, contact the dean or vice-president, academic, at Humber and speak to them about this. It's an issue that needs to be looked at in more of an indiviual manner. There are some ways the institution can accommodate for special circumstances for some students.
Q: I wanted to know what is the latest information on the college strike is and if classes will be resumed on MONDAY? And how long will this strike take action!!!!
A: There's no indication how long the strike will last. Currently, the two sides are not at the bargaining table and there's been no indication they are going back. As it stands now, it's not likely students will be going back to school Monday.
Q: The Canadian Federation of Students is greatly concerned about the quality of education and the impact that has been caused by the huge decrease in full-time faculty, increased class sizes, and increased use of part-time instructors. What is the College Student Alliance's position on these issues, and will you make your position public? Do you support OPSEU's drive for quality in the classroom?
A: The College Student Alliance is extremly concerned about all those issues as well. When talking about issue of part-time faculty, that's the result of 15 years of underfunding of the system. We support the hiring of more full-time faculty to improve the quality of education.
We want to make sure that when you look at class sizes in the college system, they are alot better than the university side. You may have hundreds or a thousand students in a lecture hall - you don't get that in a college. The design of our education and curriculum can't be done with classes of that size.
The CSA supports having smaller class sizes where necessary to improve the quality of education and keep the hands-on, interactive nature of those college classes.
Q: I really appreciate this opportunity to ask this question. My son is in an apprenticeship and just started the first schooling portion. He completed one week and one day when the teachers went on strike. What happens now? Does he go back to his apprentice employer? And if he does, what happens to his unemployment? And what are the chances of his courses being started where the strike made them leave off? Or will the college just say "too bad, so sad" and leave these guys to start their eight weeks another time? Thanks for any information you can pass on.
A: The Ministry of Training, Colleges and Universities has a website devoted to apprenticeships. Also check out this government website for other frequently asked questions. That would be your best bet. Otherwise, check with your son's college for specific information. Before the strike, all of the colleges were working on contingency plans for all programs. Why don't you try contacting your school's academic dean or academic vice-president?
Q: Can students take the colleges to court for lost time, not providing education that was paid for in advance, additional costs such as housing or lost employment opportunities, just to name a few. Has any college ever been sued over this?
A: A class-action suit from the college students could be a possibility, and a direction someone might take, or one thing our organization could do. No Ontario college has ever been sued by students in terms of a strike, but no Ontario college students have lost a school year to a strike; missed time was made up and everything was back to normal. Those strikes, however, were in the fall.
Q: Hi. I'm attending Canadore College in North Bay and am currently in the placement portion of my course in social service/social worker. I am due to graduate this year.
I'm not able to attend my placement at Ontario Works during the strike due to, I presume, the legal issues involved. Will these missed hours have to be made up after the strike, or have I lost this time altogether? Will my not being able to fulfill the required hours in placement jeopardize my completion of the program, resulting in not being able to graduate?
A: Currently, no decision has been set as to whether the school year will be extended or if students will have to redo it next year. It will be looked at institution by institution and program by program, and depending on how long the strike lasts that will also affect the decision.
Field placements are being decided program by program, placement by placement - whether you go or not is different for each one.
Q: Are college students at risk of losing their semester? If this strike continues, at what point will the college education board declare that students cannot compensate for missed classroom time?
A: Currently, the school year is not in jeopardy. When we get to week three, the school year does become in jeopardy. There are some variances per program - some are on 14 week semesters, some 15 or 16 - but generally week three is seen as the cutoff point.
Q: I am writing to inquire about the OPSEU strike, whether it impacts night classes as well as the full-time students. I am currently enrolled at George Brown College and am quite curious as to whether I will have classes this Thursday evening.
A: Night classes and continuing education classes are most likely taught by part-time faculty, who are not represented by OPSEU, so they are not involved in this strike. Whether night classes are running varies from college to college. I'd recommend conferring with your college, checking its website as to whether night classes are still running.
Q: Hi. My daughter is in the second year of a collaborative nursing program at Ryerson University and George Brown College (it is a university program). One part of students from this program is studying at Ryerson and the other part at George Brown College. They are studying the same subjects and they are all having exams at the same time, and most of these exams are in Ryerson auditoriums.
My question is: What is going to happen to such students? At the particular moment, all Ryerson students from the same program are studying. It is no matter Ryerson or George Brown - we all pay the same tuition. Is it right to keep our children out of school?
A: The George Brown students are obviously out on strike, but when it comes to these unique, hybrid programs, it's very difficult to sort out. There's a similar problem with Guelph-Humber because the majority are taught by college faculty, so they aren't in school either.
Those who are currently taught by the college faculty, they obviously aren't having classes. And it's not like they can go over to Ryerson and do classes there, it doesn't work that way. Everyone is at a disadvantage in the college system right now. When you have a hybrid program and some students are here and some there, there are going to be differences.
Q: Why are the university teacher/professors on strike in the classrooms of Laurentian University (satellite location) at Georgian College in Barrie? Does this not label them as in an illegal strike position? Why are they telling their students they are out because they are in support of the college staff? I have phoned and left my number and e-mail address at Laurentian University/Sudbury with my questions and concerns, as a parent, and have not received a response. I want to know!!!
A: Although the university professors are not represented by the Ontario Public Service Employees Union (OPSEU), because they are teaching on campus, and teaching full-time, it would be my assumption that there was a decision for them not to teach at all. Students in those programs may be taught by university faculty, and college faculty, and there may be a mix. What the school may be saying is that full-time students don't attend class, regardless of who teaches them.
Q: As a college student in the final year of my program, I am of course going to enjoy this strike should it last a couple of days. But, like the rest of the students, I am concerned if it runs any longer and begins to affect our academic year. If our year does become jeopardized, what rights do we have as students in terms of tuition refunds and the financial burdens that may result in a cancelled school year?
A: Currently, it hasn't been decided whether the school year will be extended or cancelled. From our perspective, no students will be charged more if the school year is extended, and financial assistance has been provided in the past to students hurt by a strike through OSAP, giving those who need financial assistance because of an extended school year. In regards to tuition refunds, that hasn't happened because students haven't ever lost the school year in the college system.
Q: Does the government or colleges have any plans to help students, soon-to-be graduates like myself who should be out looking for work but have to complete an extended school year, or even redo the semester? When will the government start thinking about forcing the teachers back to work?
A: Nothing has been decided as yet about the school year. The government is encouraging both sides back to the table. We need the government to do more, to put down an iron fist to say 'get back to the table now,' before we get to a situation where the school year is in jeopardy.
The government will look at back-to-work legislation when the school year is getting close to being jeopardized. College teachers were legislated back to work in 1984 after 23 days.
Q: Do you have any idea when this strike will be finished?
A: No one has any idea at this point how long the strike will last. Previous strikes by Ontario college teachers lasted 20 days (1989), 23 days (1984) and 14 days (1979).
Q: Just wondering what will happen to students who have their second semesters in the summer? Will this semester be moved to the fall?
A: Nothing has been decided as yet regarding the school year. Students are advised to keep in touch with their college for further developments.
Q: What will happen if the strike continues from now until end of semester (April)? Do I get my money back? Or will the semester continue in the summer? Will we need to retake the courses in the new school year?
A: Nothing has been decided regarding the school year. However, no college student has ever lost a school year because of a teacher strike.
Q: When will talks resume? How long can this strike last?
A: There are no plans for talks to resume at the bargaining table as yet. The strike will go on until the two sides reach an agreement -- as has happened in two previous college student strikes -- or through provincial legislation, as happened in the 1984 strike.
I have 2 boys in college. One is just in his first year at Fanshawe, and the other has one more course at Seneca after this semester is done.
If this strike continues what kind of education can they be getting when the teachers will be rushing them through their programmes so that they can say that no one lost their semester.
Neither my children nor I can afford the extra money it would cost to keep them in their accomodations for an extra month. The place my youngest son is at would require a one year lease which we cannot afford at this time as we have already paid first and last months rent at the house he will be living in next year.
He should not have to take on any additional OSAP (which he would have to pay back when he is finished his course) and fall deeper into debt because through no fault of his, his schooling could not be finished in time.
Last, but not least, these kids have summer jobs lined up which they will lose if they become unavailable. These jobs are necessary for them to continue their education.
Now tell me again, if everyone is so concerned about the students, why are they still out of school??????
Posted by: Mrs. G.S. McLaughlin | March 24, 2006 at 08:02 PM
I am astonished that college students can be utilized as pawns by the union and college mangement. The union choose a critical time for students to walk off the job. College management make promises to students regarding "completion strategies" without disclosing details all so that students do not start to withdraw from their classes. I cannot believe that their has yet to be in serious government intervention.
Posted by: Raman Rai | March 23, 2006 at 09:42 PM
Last week the colleges proclaimed that they had Semester Completion Strategies in place for students and that the specifics would be announced the week of March 20th. It is late in the week and not a word has been said about the specifics of this Semester Completion Strategy. I am very curious about what my college plans to do in order for students not to miss out on their semester. Furthermore, the negotiation process between the two parties has been handled in terrible fashion. For instance, a media blackout of negotiations has worked to the benefit of both parties in that media pressure on the two had dissipated on the weekend and the two days of talk. Specifically, what was discussed during these 20 hours of talk? What ideas were put forward?
Posted by: Rob | March 23, 2006 at 08:49 AM
So, the college presidents say there is not enough money in the system to hire desparately needed professors. The Province says it has been pumping money into the system for years. Hmmmm, where did all the money go?
Loyalist College president, Doug Auld from 1998 to 2004: salary $116,000 to $185,000. That's a 59% increase over 6 years for an average raise of 8% each year.
College Boreal president, Gisele Chretien from 1998 to 2003: salary $104,000 to $184,000. That's a 77% increase over 5 years for an average raise of 12% each year.
Sanford Fleming College president, Brian Desbiens from 1998 to 2004: salary $138,000 to $200,000. That's a 45% increase over 6 years for an average raise of 6% each year.
Algonquin College president, Robert Gillett from 1998 to 2002: salary $126,000 to $199,000. That's a 58% increase over 4 years for an average raise of 12% each year.
Humber College president, Robert Gordon from 1996 to 2004: salary $129,000 to $259,000. That's a 101% increase over 8 years for an average raise of 9% each year.
Lambton College president, Anthony Hanlon from 2002 to 2004: salary $110,000 to $177,000. That's a 61% increase over 2 years for an average raise of 27% each year.
Centennial College president, Richard Johnson from 2001 to 2004: salary $150,000 to $267,000. That's a 78% increase over 3 years for an average raise of 21% each year.
Durham College president, Gary Polonsky from 1996 to 2004: salary $114,000 to $228,000. That's a 100% increase over 8 years for an average raise of 9% each year.
Seneca College president, Stephen Quinlan from 1996 to 2001: salary $124,000 to $374,000 (yes, that's right). That's a 202% increase over 5 years for an average raise of 25% each year.
Fanshawe College president, Howard Rundle from 1996 to 2004: salary $109,000 to $201,000. That's a 84% increase over 8 years for an average raise of 8% each year.
George Brown College president, Frank Sorochinsky 1998 to 2004: salary $138,000 to $267,000. That's a 93% increase over 6 years for an average raise of 12% each year.
Georgian College president, Brian Tamblyn from 1999 to 2004: salary $116,000 to $213,000. That's a 84% increase over 5 years for an average raise of 13% each year.
Conestoga College president, John Tibbits from 1998 to 2004: salary $138,000 to $259,000. That's a 88% increase over 6 years for an average raise of 11% each year.
Sheridan College president, Robert Turner from 2001 to 2004: salary $114,000 to $230,000. That's a 102% increase over 3 years for an average raise of 26% each year.
And let's not forget the increasing numbers of newly created vice-president positions like Council spokeswoman Joy Warketin's of Fanshawe College. Joy cries poverty yet from 2000 to 2004, her own salary went from $101,000 to $147,000. That's a 46% increase over 4 years for an average of 10% per year. Hey Joy, what's good for the goose ...
If college management weren't so busy paying themselves such outrageous salary increases, maybe they'd recognize that there is, in fact, a lot of money in the system to hire much needed new faculty. But, then again, they will probably just give themselves even bigger raises this coming year for doing such a good job with this situation.
The colleges are bloating themselves with increasing numbers of overpaid, unaccountable upper management, while strangling teachers. Such folly can only lead to the destruction of the college system. NONE of the new provincial money should be used to pay for any management salary increases. They have had enough and do not deserve a penny more.
[All data from published Province of Ontario Public sector employee salary disclosures over $100,000.]
Posted by: Nobel Laureate | March 22, 2006 at 01:34 PM
Leon King wrote:
"The preview shows me posting this at 5:40 am. Its 12:40
your clock is wrong. :-) )"
Hello, this is the Internet! People can read and post to this site from *anywhere* in the world (i.e. any time zone).
The mostly likely explanation is that the date and time are shown in Greenwich Mean Time (GMT), not Toronto local time. As a matter of fact, GMT is +5 hours relative to Toronto time (Eastern Standard Time), so 5:40 A.M GMT = 12:40 A.M. EST.
I find it scary that you're a Professor of Computer Engineering and you've got a degree in Applied Math but you couldn't figure that out on your own.
Posted by: An interested observer | March 22, 2006 at 01:27 PM
Money IS the reason we are on strike but it is not higher salaries that we are fighting for. What we want is the committment to hire full-time faculty, smaller class sizes, properly equipped labs etc.
The reality is that College Administrators act as if a dollar spent "in the classroom" is a dollar wasted, an unavoidable line in the budget that must be minimized. If management cared about quality in education they would restrict their own pay increases to the same percentages that the union negotiates for the faculty. Even that would be a sweet deal for managers because we, the teachers, are the ones who sacrifice our income during the strike.
Nobody is without fault but this strike was caused the frustration we get from watching the management milk the system for all they can get while we take the heat.
For a true "teacher", this is a fabulous way to make a living. Great teachers are passionate about education. That is precisely WHY we've gone on strike and why it is hurting us every bit as much as the students cought in the middle.
Sadly, if we don't to stand up for the long-term welfare of the system who will?
Posted by: Mike Conte | March 21, 2006 at 12:50 AM
I am an Architecture student at Sheridan College and I have a few concerns that I would like to be addressed.
1) If the school year is reorganized will we miss out on things we need to learn for next year? If we do, is this not a breech of contract since our syllabus is a contract between students and the department?
2) We have been told that students need not worry about finances because our OSAP will be reassessed, so does that mean we are expected to pay MORE money back to the government because of this strike?
3) When students are told that arrangements will be made on an individual basis for each student, does that mean that if classes are held on weekends but students could not make arrangements for this, would alternative options be available for such cases?
4) Will there be ANY compensation for students once the strike is over?
Posted by: Jennifer Benedict | March 18, 2006 at 10:59 AM
In response to “the University student”
I apologize, but my income is in the area $30K per year (same as a janitor or security in the college), and I am not in the classroom because I am not able to teach a subject to 43 students in a room having 40 seats…(because we know there will be drops).
The “Red Army” in the Second World War used this technique, when there was a shortage of guns – the second attack row will start without guns, and they will pick them “en passant”, because “we know there will be causalities”. All you need for successful implementation is a couple of commissars to shoot the defectors.
I enjoy my work and I want to do it right – I can comfortably lecture in a class of 80, but I cannot grant individual attention for a student in a lab having more than 20 (all I have is 2 hours).
I strongly believe that opened discussion and confrontation of ideas is crucial for the training of a professional today – it is not basically about learning skills, it is about learning how to learn in this dynamic environment, and communicating with a mentor is the base of it. We are singing “Vivat Academia, Vivat proferores” for 2000 years now, and despite our new on-line tools, I am sure we will still do it in the next millennium.
Posted by: Caius Grozav | March 18, 2006 at 09:51 AM
Our NDP controlled union has decided to take us into a strike for merely ideological reasons. This is all about imposing their doctrines. If not, just see, in the OPSEU website, the pictures of the all the very happy NDP celebrities in yesterday's rally.
Every time that they give a speech their favorite name is Bob Rae. The feel really satisfying talking about the Rae report all the time. The Rae report this, the Rae report that. Yep, the same Bob Rae of Rae's days, who took this province into record levels of fiscal deficits, debt, unemployment, and recession but now since he is going to bid for the Liberal party leadership, he needs some proping up.
The Rae report is just that, a report. It is not sacred or a cult to be religiously followed
The union do not care about the students nor the faculty. When this strike is over, we are going to be deep in the hole financially. With luck, we are going to be 5 to 6 weeks without collecting any paycheck. In the mean time the bills are piling up, I had to skip one mortgage payment already and my children have needs that I can not afford to pay.
What is your mind OSPEU people? Do you think that we are all rich? That we can stay a month or more without getting paid? We are hurting here and we will never recover from this.
Posted by: Faculty | March 17, 2006 at 08:22 PM
You've got to be kidding me. The teachers are absolutely without any sort of doubt WRONG. This strike is disgusting! Look at the facts of it...
They want whats best for us; so explain to me how striking and putting our semester in danger is the best for us?
Explain to me why they want to reduce mandetory class time from 14 hours per week to 12 hours per week?
Explain why they want more money for less work?
College professors are the highest paid in the country. This shouldn't be an option! McGuinty step in and put these 'slackers' back to work!
Posted by: Zach Bussey | March 17, 2006 at 12:23 AM
Comment: The direction college education is heading, I am in favour of an increase in online programs. This would certainly provide a workable alternative. Politics, and greed have allowed our education system to eroded at the expense of the students.
Technology has to work to the benefit of the students.
Posted by: Greg Motayne | March 16, 2006 at 11:06 PM
How come college teachers are demanding for low class sizes where as university teachers aren't? I think university class sizes are much more higher compared to college class sizes.
Posted by: Malaroi | March 16, 2006 at 09:09 PM
Something many students and the public are not aware of is the fact the community colleges have cut the classroom hours for programs several times over the past decade. Teachers are left with fewer classroom hours to teach the same curriculum. (Programs that once had 25 hours a week of class now have 18.)This cost saving measure has reduced the quality of education. Students, many of them working long hours during the week to afford school, now have to cover material formerly taught in the classroom on their own. The teachers have less time to teach more students because as our contact hours in class have been reduced, the number of students in class has increased. In 31 years of teaching at a community college, I have experienced class size going from 20 to 80. This prevents me from getting to know the students and also inhibits the use of student-centred teaching and evaluation methods. The experience for the student has diminished significantly. When faced with 200 students in a semester, it is impossible to assign weekly quizzes and evaluation. Even the most dedicated teacher cannot keep up with the marking. As a result, students get fewer evaluation opportunities with tests and assignments being worth a much higher percentage of their final grade. This gives them less frequent feedback and less chance to recover from a bad grade. Faculty are forced to move away from student-centred practices in teaching methods and evaluation because of the large classes, denying students opportunities to develop the critical thinking and communications skills that are so important in the workplace. Ontario spends the least amount per student on postsecondary education in Canada, and the overcrowded classrooms and reduction of program hours are a symptom of this neglect. And while students justifiably feel like pawns in this dispute, so do many teachers. I believe the college managers have orchestrated this strike, by tabling a ridiculous offer, in an attempt to gain more funding from the province. We rejected the offer with a 94% vote and the strike vote was 80%. They weren't listening even though we spoke loud and clear. Quality is the issue.Management's team keeps telling you about the salary offer, but they neglect to tell you about their other demands that will only exacerbate the crisis in colleges. As college faculty we want to do our job, but we also have a responsibility to ensure we can do that job effectively. Our salary demands are not out of line with the raises obtained by other sectors, but take the time to look at the recent salary increases for college presidents! With salaries well over $200,000, (as high as $290,000) the 12 and 15% increases received by presidents make the 4% we are asking for seem more than reasonable.
The facts are out there--find them. Talk to a teacher on the picket line. Go the the OPSUE website. What we really want is to be able to DO OUR JOBS!
Posted by: Pat Dockrill | March 16, 2006 at 01:38 PM
Hi i wanted to know if this strike goes longer the 4 weeks and we dont have this semester completion anymore are there any chances for us students money would be refunded?
Posted by: Hussain | March 16, 2006 at 01:30 PM
This is something I really don't get: If colleges in Ontario complain that they don't have that much funding, then why don't they do what universities do, by starting a capital campaign? I have been to both college and university, and I have not received one phone call or mailing from college about donations. With university, I probably received my first phone call for donations around February of my graduation year (to donate money for a class gift/bursary).
Posted by: Cynthia | March 16, 2006 at 12:41 PM
I was just wondering if this strike continues for more than a few weeks, who is going to pay us students for our lost time wages? Most of us who are planning on graduating in the next month are expecting to start work shortly after, and may have jobs lined up. If we cannot start our jobs on time who is going to compensate us for the work time we have lost? Thank you to the teachers who are so inconsiderate and don't care about us students or our futures. Your selfishness is greatly appreciated.
Posted by: An Angry Co-op Student | March 16, 2006 at 11:17 AM
What about the students involved in trade school? Will they be back to school this term?
Posted by: Jeffery | March 16, 2006 at 10:30 AM
RE: Leon King's posting Mar 14
If the two sides aren't going to get back to talking, let's have more of the kind of conversation Mr King started.
The management and union positions are really polarized this time - union wants no change to the formula except stricter limits on prep, evaluation and class sizes; more control of their 'professional' responsibilities (new academic freedom langauge); and they want to direct staffing. Management wants to completely rethink how workload is described(pilots, etc.)
The common ground is hard to find without giving up a lot from either position.
I think the parties did the right thing in 2004 by setting the workload discussion outside the actual contract negotiations. But we didn't get an agreement, so now we have a strike.
The responsibility for failing to resolve the workload issue rests with both parties. Using the students in a strike situation to leverage a forced resolution is wrong. Workload is a college issue between management and the union; education is an issue between the students and the college.
The college (its management and union)needs to work out its problems with workload without jeopardizing students' education.
I worked in both faculty and management, and I know that the rhetoric issued for public consumption (through the media, etc.) isn't grounded in the kind of conversation I might have had with college collegues over a coffee.
But the rhetoric gets in the way - especially in a strike.
Finally, the discussion about salaries (faculty, management) is a red herring and distracts from the important issue which is getting back to the bargaining and back to the students. College systems with a 'single' college administration (Newfoundland, Nova Scotia, New Brunswick, for example) will have fewer senior adminstrators, but they will still have the mid level administrative functions spread across multiple campuses. And those systems aren't as nearly as large as Ontario.
Posted by: S. Kallio | March 15, 2006 at 08:06 PM
I am currently a university student in my final term, I feel the pain for all of those college students out there in their final terms of study and having the worry that they may have to extend their college "career" to another 4 months. I think that this was a very stunned time to have a strike. I understand that everyone in this world wants more money, and I also understand that it is hard to teach subjects such as welding, nursing, and other "hands-on" subjects in classes of over 20 or 25 students. However, how is punishing all of the college students in Ontario going to fix these issues?? I do not know a whole lot about the college system, as I am in university but I was wondering if an increase in admission requirements could possibly "fix" the class size issue. On the $$$$$ issue, I never thought that I would see people who I considered mentors for giving their time and patience to teaching young people complain about money. I always thought that teaching was a "passion", well through these past two weeks of hearing about "I want this" and "Give us this" I have to say that I no longer have that same opinion of college teachers. (And YES I do have University profs and lab hands that are making the low $55 000 - $60 000 incomes that you other people are talking about.. and well the last time I checked I'm still in class)
Posted by: University studnet | March 15, 2006 at 02:22 AM
I am international student in Canada and to me it seems like from all this, colleges will loose business from international students. lack of facilities, increasing tution fee, restrictions on off campus work, are just few examples that directly leads to negative impact on foreign students.
Posted by: Vikas | March 15, 2006 at 02:16 AM
I'll preface by my remarks by saying that I'm a professor of Computer Engineering at Humber College. I'm amazed that the college system is on strike given that the compromises are fairly obvious.
1. Management should drop the request to remove the limit of
six classes per professor. The only reason way to teach
that many classes would be to either split the teaching
between multiple profs or reduce the weekly hours in a
course below 2 - not a good move for students.
2. There will be a substantial number of higher salaried
profs who will be retiring in the next five years - commit
to replacing each of these people with 1.3 full time profs
with preference given to sesssional and part time employees.
Given the that it takes up to 20 years for people to reach the
top rung (vs. 8 in the public schools) this should be
affordable.
3. Sweeten the pot for the settlement to 3.5% per year instead of
2%+1% (staggered - a cute accounting gimmick that reduces
the payout) so that the settlement is more in line with
settlements recently given to high school teachers. Reduce
the length of the agreement to 3 years so that the final costs
will not be too high.
4. The negotiating committee's request that course assignments
be made for a full year is OK but they need to add back the
language that sufficient notice of a change needs to be made
prior to the course being offered. Faculty should have a
span of 6 workings weeks to prepare for a course.
Averaging work hours over the year without overtime is a
non-starter - one can drown in a river with an "average"
height of 3 inches. Not to mention the accounting nightmare
and that the "average' looks like it would include non-contact
weeks. (The proposed change "maintains the average" but
redefines what "average' refers to - thus increasing the
workload - trust me on this - I have a minor in Applied Math
:-) )
5. The final issue is Management's proposal regarding
"experimental delivery" vs. faculty's request that workload
assignments better reflect actual time spent based on
studies initiated by both parties after the last contract. This
is a tougher nut to crack. The "experimental delivery"
proposal is poorly defined - the $1000 bonus for participation
would likely not cover the extra time spent (esp. for online
development and delivery!) That the "experiment" would be
necessarily assigned to a whole department, with the goal of
looking for "efficiencies in delivery" makes it kind of suspect.
Usually this means more time spent for the same pay.
Conversely the faculty's request to be paid more fully for
actual time spent is not something that is likely to resolved
in this round of negotiation.
Link the two objectives together. Reduce the scope of the
experimental delivery to individual courses, have the
faculty and administrative liason maintain time sheets and
allow time for biweekly review and pay them both for actual
time spent. If the experiment is deemed successful by
both parties then repeat to validate the test. Identify
similar activities by component in other courses and adjust
the attributed workload in these courses to reflect actual time
spent.
I'm a little cautious about this one - I once tried to do a study
of the benefits to the college of unpaid overtime (extra work
done purely because people like doing what they do) and was
told to stop - because once the work was identified then
people would have to be paid for it. However my proposal
can work either way so in that sense its a compromise. There
are also other issues (ie: dental and optical benefits, benefits
for retirees) which need some work as well but these should
be fairly routine
Note - if I were negotiating for faculty I'd nake a more
extended proposal in order to meet somewhere around what
I'm suggesting. Nevertheless I believe that both sides could
and should arrive at a similar position, better sooner than
later.
(The preview shows me posting this at 5:40 am. Its 12:40
your clock is wrong. :-) )
Posted by: Leon King | March 15, 2006 at 12:48 AM
i cant believe some of these comments
"Why do the teachers stop teaching my child halfway through the job and not expect to give a refund?"
"on strike for improving the quality of education because the only thing the strike has done so far is disrupt education."
"seriously shame on those teachers who are on strike, they are only after their own benefits, I think they make more than enough money, they shouldn't be complaining for ridiculous reasons "
ignorant comments. read the facts people.
i am a student at Conestoga College, am i happy that my teachers are on strike? NO.
do i want to finish my school year? YES
am i mad at my teachers? NO i am mad at the situation. teachers are not saying no to a refund, they have no say in that matter!
Yes this is disrupting. thats the theory of strikes, DISRUPT the process to get action. do i feel like a pawn? yes, but i would still be a pawn even if there was no strike. i would just be a much dumber one.
Posted by: m.s. | March 14, 2006 at 08:16 PM
The interest rate relief and debt relief programs offered to past post-secondary students by both the federal and provincial governments are typically inadequate and hidebound with red tape. None of them take into consideration the fact that the banks can call student loans anytime with no notice, no recourse and no reasons given. Former PM Mulroney ensured that this would happen by guaranteeing student loans if the bank managers decided for whatever reason that they did not want them. This amounted to an incentive to call student loans as it turned out, forcing scores of students to file for bankruptcy. Of course, they then changed the rules so that students would not have the same rights as any other ordinary citizen. Most students on OSAP/CSL loans do not realize that their world can come tumbling down at the whim of a far off bank manager playing by bank rules, and that basically they have no rights.
Far fetched? Nope, it happened to me! The bank sent me a notice that I had to file a form from my school saying that I was still a registered student. Fine, except they sent the notice giving me only 21 days to file to the wrong address. By the time I received the notice, the 21 days were up and my loan was already called. The notice did not come from my local bank branch, which had my correct address, but from head office in another city. This manager gave no consideration to the fact that students tend to move around a lot. Of course, Canada Post no longer forwards your mail for free like they used to. When your loan is called you are finished as a student because the entire amount is due immediately, and you will not be allowed to register again until it is paid in full.
Posted by: Richard Banigan | March 14, 2006 at 07:43 PM
I am an adult learner. I choose to take time away from my job to have more job opportunities. But now that the thought of losing the year has come up it frustrates me. The thought of possibly having to continue school into the summer or come back next year is not an option that i feel i have. This strike does not take the current student's lives into account.
Posted by: jenn | March 14, 2006 at 06:49 PM
I would like to know if students are going to get back part of their tuition if not all of it because of this strike? i am in my second year at george brown college and i think that neither side cares about how this is going to affect students plans for the summer.
Posted by: Mark Roder | March 14, 2006 at 03:35 PM