Winners vs. The Bay

Fashion editor Bernadette Morra, stylist Derick Chetty and fashion writer Erin Kobayashi are discussing Winners' new designer department called The Runway, and The Bay's new Baia collection. Send your thoughts to nakedlunch@thestar.ca or click on the comments link below.

Designer outfits from The Runway, a new department at Winners.

Winners has opened a new "department" called The Runway, which promises the world's most coveted designer labels for far less than luxury boutique prices. This morning we fanned out to 3 of the 4 Toronto stores. I went to Bloor St., Derick went to College Park and Erin went to Lawrence and Bathurst. I arrived at Bloor St. at 8:30 (it had opened at 8). There was a black carpet and white balloons out front, and a guy inside the doorway serving muffins and coffee. It looked like they were expecting a line-up of people but the store was dead - just me, a couple of Russian shoppers, a youngish Asian woman with a huge Chanel caviar purse, and a very elegant older lady in Escada casuals. How was the Lawrence store? Bernadette

Muffins and coffee?!  Lucky you!  I went hungry, the Bathurst and Lawrence store did not offer shoppers that!  I also arrived at 8:30 and the store was quiet but at around 9 am, it picked up and customers were steering shopping carts full of designer clothes.  It was like watching bumper cars, a lot of carts were smashing into one another.  I met one Winners shopper who attends every special event at the store and she had two shopping carts full of designer clothes for herself and her daughter.  She thought the selection was phenomenal but I was less impressed.  What I noticed first was the Pucci and Missoni labels, bright colourful prints that stood out on the floor.  Erin

Yes, there were some Pucci T-shirts at Bloor St., too, for $139.99. But I didn't see any Missoni. I did find some Valentino including a champagne-coloured pleated charmeuse skirt which was half price, from $1,000 to $499.99. There were a few pretty Valentino floral skirts and a pink cashmere blend cardigan with cream lace appliques for $479.99, which I still found quite pricey since I have a feeling they weren't from his top, top collection. Likewise there were jackets from Donna Karan's Signature collection which I don't think is her top line. Bernadette

When I first arrived I met the pr rep, Shannon, at Bloor St. and she explained that many of the labels (which SHE isn't allowed to mention because of agreements with Winners' vendors) have been carried in their stores before. But rather than making the customer pick through all the middle of the road lines to find the rare designer label, Winners will now group the higher end pieces together with signage that reads, "The Runway." Winners has also had "designer events" twice a year in the past, Shannon explained, where higher end pieces would be available across the country. But now, they will be carried in a regular basis in a smaller group of stores.

But I still felt like it was a bit of an Easter egg hunt. There were some Chanel and Gucci sunglasses behind the jewelry counter, and a couple of Valentino purses in the handbag area. Though some of the racks did have The Runway signs on them, they weren't necessarily "the world's most coveted brands." For instance, there was quite a lot of Pink Tartan, Cynthia Steffe in the Bloor St. mix. However I did see a fantastic khaki suede Moschino Cheap and Chic blazer for around $250. Bernadette

I went to the College Park location around 8:30am and not a lot of shoppers were around which made it easy to peruse the racks. The "Runway" section is located right at the front. And yes, coffee, muffins and bagels were served to give a bit of a happening. First thing I zeroed in on was a rack of Pucci. The classic print dresses trimmed with feathers, some fantastic bags and shoes also by Pucci. Another fab find was a Narciso Rodriguez gown - a label you don't often come across in a discount retailer. The Versace stuff looked several seasons too old but there were some cute jackets by Alberta Ferretti. And yes there were brand name sunglasses like Dior, Gucci and YSL but in the wrong shapes - tiny. You need big sunglasses this season. I was surprised that some of the signage on the racks actually had the designer names, I thought they were not allowed to advertise the labels. Derick

Shannon, the pr person, explained that Winners is allowed to display the designer names they carry on in-store signage. But they aren't allowed to advertise those names outside the stores. I also found some Alberta Ferretti, but it was the less-expensive Philosophy collection. And I got a pair of huge purple Gucci sunglasses for $99. Did you guys buy anything? Bernadette

I didn't buy anything. The "Runway" section does not have men's. I did wander around and was surprised to see a shoe section with lots of men's shoes. We get so caught up with designer labels sometimes you forget that the top tier names can sometimes churn out mediocre merchandise - especially the secondary lines. I came across a black velour hoodie by Emporio Armani but when I touched it the fabric was hideous. Derick

I didn't buy anything either.  If they had my size though, I would purchase a little black dress with leopard lining by Dolce and Gabanna that they were selling for $699.99.  The little black dresses didn't look as dated as the other pieces they were selling.  I saw a white leather jacket by Versace that looked like it was from the 80s.  A cute accessory I saw was a Versace i-Pod case but it only came in one colour.  That's the problem, the selection is very limited in terms of size and colour availability.  One shopper remarked, "it looks like stuff that didn't sell the first time around."  She was holding a green, silk Pink Tartan dress.  I don't understand why Pink Tartan was being featured though, because I have seen that label at Winners before.  Erin

Outfit from Baia, a new private label collection at The Bay.

So the bottom line is that The Runway isn't mind-blowing. It's still somewhat hit and miss in terms of selection and the pieces can be dated. In that case, for a woman who is looking for a lot of style at a good price, is The Bay's new Baia collection the answer? And how is that label pronounced, by the way? Bernadette

It's pronounced bay-a. I'm not sure I like the name but it's a great selection of office attire for professional women. Skirt suits, the little black dress in lightweight wool and knit separates. If you're looking for special occasion pieces, you might have to look at Winners or The Bay's high end department, The Room. Derick

The quality of the Baia clothing is high.  I noticed that everything except a few lightweight sweaters were made in Canada.  I thought the best pieces were the basic ones, the pencil skirts and the suits which were streamlined and looked slimming on the models.  They also sell the clothes from size 4 to 16, it was nice not to see Baia jumping into vanity sizing and making size 0. Erin

Baia is designed by a team who used to do Holt Renfrew private label. Is it Holt Renfrew calibre in terms of styling? Or is it more middle-of-the-road? Bernadette

I wouldn't call it middle-of-the-road. It is classic with a nod to current runway trends. There was a black and white striped top that was quite Edie Sedgewick. The skirt suit is already poised to be a hit for next season. And I loved the little cropped white jacket trimmed with black for $375. Derick

It sounds kind of Banana Republic. Bernadette

It looked it in terms of that polished professional workwear. And the prices seemed similar. But I do think the quality is there. You can feel the quality in the fabrics. Derick

I will definitely check out Baia for myself, both personally and professionally! Bernadette

Comments

[Kasia]

I have found lately that I really have to mentally prepare myself to shop at Winners. Whereas I used to love to go and get a bargain, I now find I don't have as much time to spend combing thorugh racks for a fab steal. Maybe, it is because I am now a bit older, but I have really started shopping at the Bay and I love it. The clothes have really improved in style since I have last been several years ago, and they carry some great small brands like Kookai, James Jeans, Vero Moda, and Kenzie that I love! The downtown store's lingerie, hosiery, and shoe selection is better than any other store in the mall. I wouldn't shop for those particular items anywhere else anymore (ok, maybe I still get shoes at Town Shoes). And comparatively, I find that the Winners prices are no longer as good as they used to be. Is it just me?

[Naomi]

I agree with Kasia's comments about the state of Winners today. I've shopped at Winners for probably close to 15 years (really!) and I think I have to end the affair. It's not fun or of much value to shop there anymore on the whole - high effort and you do have to mentally steel yourself, shoddier selection and of poorer quality (I don't even care about finding 'the' designer label), higher prices...becoming a 3rd rate experience.

[Jillian Walker]

My biggest disappointment with Winners is that the stores in the city have far more to choose from than the ones out here in Durham Region. Why do the 'burbs get all the cast-offs? If I go into Winners 6 times in a month, I'm lucky to walk away with a single purchase. In fact, I was in the Oshawa Winners last week and aside from the price tags, the quality of the clothing made me feel more like I was shopping at a second hand store than at a place that carried New with Tags. I'm completely disappointed with Winners lately and now only go there as a last resort after exhausting all my other shopping options here in "The 'Shwa".

[Deb]

I don't think I've ever bought anything at Winners except a skirt which looked great but fell apart after wearing it twice! I can't tell you how many times I've asked friends where they bought their (insert item!) only to hear Winners... but I have had no luck. I don't think I'll bother with their designer area. It sounds like an attempt to woo shoppers who realize they are selling seconds and clearances.

I can't say that my response to the Bay has been much better lately. I used to be a regular Bay client. I find small independant stores will carry unique and different products versus commodities. It's also nice to get personalized service and to be remembered - next to impossible for a chain store.