Closing in on a Ford deal

Told you it was going to be a busy week of rumours and speculation and trade talk.

It’s all very tentative and quite up in the air but the Raptors have already investigated the possibility of a blockbuster trade that would net them a veteran – yet expensive – NBA centre.

According to league sources, Toronto has had talks with the Indiana Pacers about acquiring 29-year-old Jermaine O’Neal for a package that would include T.J. Ford, Rasho Nestervoic and, perhaps, the 17th pick in this week’s draft.

The talks are not the point where any deal is imminent and a deal is certainly not assured but the source said the Raptors are aggressively trying to move Ford and O’Neal is one of their targets.

Toronto also still has serious interest in forward Boris Diaw of the Phoenix Suns and is in talks with at least three other teams for trades of a similar magnitude.

O’Neal is coming off an injury-riddled season in which he played just 42 games and averaged 13.6 points and 6.7 rebounds per game. The 6-11 centre has been working out in Las Vegas since just after the 2007-08 season ended and according to reports has just begun full-court work.

Obtaining O’Neal will be a huge two-year financial commitment for the Raptors. He’s due to make about $21 million (all figures U.S.) this season and $23 million in 2009-10. To make the trade work under NBA salary cap rules, Toronto would have to add some other pieces in addition to Ford and Nesterovic but they have several less expensive expiring contracts that would make it work.

But even if the O’Neal trade doesn’t materialize, it does signal just how hard the Raptors are trying to move Ford so they can hand over the starting point guard job to restricted free agent Jose Calderon.

With Phoenix still in the mix and the other teams having talks with Toronto, it would appear Bryan Colangelo will have plenty of options to sift through before Thursday’s draft.

Comments

[Thava]

Not a good trade for the raps, 23 million for jermaine o'neal??? are you kidding me?! I'd rather take Diaw, since he makes considerably less. I think O'Neal is way too injury prone and washed up!

[LC]

JO? Wow... this is interesting. By the way, yes, JO has some health problem and people is questioning his altitude. But I think BC is taking the gamble in a good way. The team were too soft. Sometimes the team need a spark to get things going.

Look at Rasheed in Detroit. Isn't he have some problem in Portland? But look, what he did in Pistons. (Well... yes, he led the league with Techs.) But I think this a good trade. JO has two years left on his contract, but so does TJ!

Doug, after throwing my two cents around, I have a question, do you think Bargnani will play SF a bit more in the future instead of C, if there is already JO and Bosh? JO, Bosh and Barg give the biggest frontcourt!

Blogger's note: Having seen Bargnani at small forward in Orlando and a couple of other times, I don't think that's a part of their long-term plans.

[DougG]

Other than the draft pick I like this deal. There is risk but the risk is limited to two years. Maybe they can turn Bargnani into a small forward? What chips do they have left to get the slasher once they give up TJ and Nest.? Ideally they still have a draft pick and they take one of the small forwards.

[Aaron]

Hello Doug,

Would you mention any other deals that Toronto is looking at (you mentioned other blockbusters) for trading away TJ. Besides Maggette and Diaw, who else has been discussed?

Also, what are your thoughts on the USA basketball team. Prince over Battier? Howard the only true Centre?

Blogger's note: Battier's hurt and had surgery, he was never an option; the choice was Prince over Tyson Chandler and knowing they want to use LeBron and Carmelo at the four, as they did last year, I'm not really surprised.

[JP]

So Doug, if the O'Neal trade happens... where does that leave Bargs? Back up centre or a potential starting 3? (since I feel the idea of NEEDING a 6'7" guy be a small forward is antiquated)

[jr]

bosh and O'neal are u kidding me , this twin towers is a 50 win team in the east if they healthy now we can afford to trade bargani and parker for wilcox.....

O,neal
Bosh
wilcox
kapono
calderon

[Vick]

hey dough.. thx for the scoop... well i kinda like da trade only A BIG ONLY if we don't give up our 17th pick...If we then draft batum with the pick or trade for maggete...wow what a lineup it wud be... calderon/maggete/moon/bosh/o'neal.... is dat even possible!? wow...

[Stince]

I love this deal. Firstly, it has a built in 'oops, we screwed up' option in that should O'Neal prove to be ineffective due to injuries, his huge expiring contract would make teams salivate approaching the '90-'10 trade deadline. With a lot of questions concerning Bargnani's ability to develop, Calderon's ability to run the point over a full year and O'Neal's health problems, flexibility down the road is a must, which this deal provides. And similarly, if it turns out that O'Neal is a valuable contributor, they can likely resign him for a LOT less than what he's making now.

And speaking of Bargs, having O'Neal in the middle would do wonders for his game (at least in theory). With Bosh and O'Neal handling the interior work, Bargs would be free to roam, to shoot or drive and kick, and those days when he picks up 2 quick fouls are going to hurt a lot less (not to mention likely help take a bit of the pressure off of Andrea). 3 seven footers with varying games makes for a lot of matchup problems for opposing teams and gives the Raps someone to handle just about everyone up front. And you have to imagine that the 3 of them will split time with Bargs getting a solid shot to prove he can play (assuming he can stay on the court), which would definitely help to limit injuries to O'Neal and a tired Bosh coming off an Olympic stint. Furthermore, the Raps will have a much better shot at running the floor with Rasho out of the way and 3 bigs who can all run, flanked by shooters heading for the corners.

And lastly, you get a relatively young (he's only 29), likely VERY motivated center that plays solid D and will help to spread the floor for the shooters. Think of trying to match up with O'Neal, Bosh, Calderon, Parker and Kapono. Who do you leave? Interior D and solid rebounding are key for a jump shooting team, which seems to be the direction Toronto is going. The only problem will be a lack of penetration on days when the post game isn't working out.

A big concern though might be having to pay Calderon a ton of money because a rival GM decides to offer an overpriced deal that the Raps are forced to match with TJ already being gone. And if they're talking seriously about this deal, hopefully it means management is willing to spend the bucks.

[Jeff Steele]

Thanks for the info, this week is going to be a thriller for Raps fans by the sound of it. If Colangelo convinces Bird to pull the trigger on this deal I think he'll once again be in the running for Exec of the Year.

Andrea can still get 20-25 minutes off the bench matching up against easier defenders like in his rookie season and it could revive his game and make the Rap's bench one of the toughest in the league. If Ginobli and Barbosa can thrive off the pine I don't see why Sam would have a problem bringing his #1 overall pick off the bench too.

[Dan]

It's a huge risk with his health. If he is anywhere close to form he will be exactly what the Raptors need at center. Bosh can score in the post but he is not a back to the basket player like Oneal. He will help the halfcourt offense. Plus if he has a decent year you have a 20 million dollar expiring contract. They still need a more athletic wing player, the problem with their defence starts on the perimeter and they need a perimeter player who can create their own shot. This is a high risk high reward trade for sure.

[Nick M]

I agree with many of the other comments that the addition of JO would really help Bosh.

I also agree with the questions about where this leaves Bargs. Does it make sense to have 2 stars and the only potential(?) star on the Raps occupying only two positions for the next two years?

I believe you wrote that many of the teams the Raps talk to want to talk about Bargs. If the deal for JO happens; given the Raps have enough assets, would BC consider a Bargs deals to get that swingman?

Lets be honest, if the Raps were starting four guys named Calderon, Bosh, JO and Jefferson/Magette then they could sign you or I to be the starting 2!

[Pintoo]

I understand the need for a big, but I don't think O'Neal is the answer. In the last three years he has played 51, 69, and 42 games and his scoring and rebounding average have gone down considerable.

Additionally, O'Neal is the fifth highest player in the NBA, I think the Raptors can get much move value than Jermaine O'Neal. Here is my proposal - why not trade Ford and Jason Kapono for Lamar Odon. Lamar Odon is the same age at O'Neal but is a double double machine and has a favourable contract.

Thoughts ?

Blogger's note: What if Lamar Odom's not on the market?

[Jeffery]

Don't include the pick in the deal.

[Jonny F]

Doug...

First of all, long time no speak!

Secondly... I'm as excited about this possibility as the next guy, but it seems to me that we still need an upgrade at the 2 and 3.

Any rumours (besides the Maggette one) about potential deals at those positions?

[gm]

Had a quick look at the Indy paper's site, and the general reaction was that Indy fans couldn't say yes to this quickly enough... That has to raise a red flag, right?

And does this move not put a lot of responsiblity on Roko to back up Jose, or will a resigned Carlos be given a lot of minutes at the point?

Blogger's note: They'll still have the full mid-level cap exception with which to look for a two or a three and a backup poing guard.

[p-dawg]

I am from Indiana and a Pacers fan. I just wanted to say, if Toronto gets J.O. in a deal and he turns out to be healthy, congrats because i think he is one of the best defensive players in the league. Takes charges better than anybody (real charges, not flopping), blocks shots, and for the person who asked about his character, he's a very high character guy and very articulate. Darn good in the community too. No, I'm not trying to sell you guys on him because none of us have the final decision on the trade anyway, but I know he doesn't want to be on a team that is rebuilding, and that is basically what the pacers are doing right now, and I think he deserves to go somewhere he has a chance to win and not be the focal point of the offense, although he definately has the ability to score.

[Graham Smith]

well if this does happen it will certainly fit the blockbuster category. Indiana really wants to shake things up and Ford would be a good idea for them, just as ONeil fits the Raptors needs -- allows Bargnani to come off the bench and play with either Bosh or ONeil and allows Kapono to really prosper as a 3 point specialist -- what an exciting week!!

[John Jordan]

It's interesting to read the comments of Pacers's fans from the Indianapolis Star blurb on this rumour (http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080623/SPORTS04/806230395/1004/sports)

They seem fairly happy to say good-bye to O'Neal. But perhaps, a fresh start is what's needed. That certainly worked for Allen and Garnett. Plus it helped rejuvenate Paul Peirce.

But I, too, still wonder about who plays the 2/3 for next year.

As far as the guy who asked about trading the pick after its been made. As long as the draft pick doesn't sign a contract with the team, he (or rather the rights to the player can be traded). For trading purposes, the rights to the player count as nothing.

However, once the draft pick signs his contract though, he can't be traded for 45 days and then his salary counts as per normal NBA trade regulations.

In terms of the extra player needed to make the salaries work (after July 1st and TJ's BYC condition ends), any one of Jamario Moon, Maceo Baston or Joey Graham would suffice under NBA regulations. Unless, there is any inclination to expand the deal beyond its current parameters. But I'm not who on the Pacers that the Raptors would want and that the Pacers would be willing to move.

Doug, have you talked with any of your equivalents that work for the Indianapolis papers to see garner their opinions this possible trade?

Blogger's note: I've talked a couple times to Mike Wells of the Indy Star on the discussions the two teams are having. We're both working our best sources to find out where the talks are right now.

[Kelsie]

Jo would help immediately on the boards and he is a good defender which we need in spades. The price is not right and he has been injury prone but he will improve us. My concern is now you only have one point guard and he is a pilon defender and does not create off the dribble.

Everyone is quick to get rid of TJ thinking Calderon is the answer to the PG position but by mid season next year everyone will see his deficiencies in an increased role. Unless BC can find a wing that can put the ball on the floor you now have NO ONE in your lineup that can create off the dribble and get to the rim.
Be careful what you wish for!

[Kelsie]

Does this officailly end the Bargniani at Centre project or allow him more time to develop coming off the bench?

Blogger's note: If the deal happens -- and it's not a sure thing -- I presume Bargnani would come off the bench and play a little at both the 4 and the 5.

[Ajitvir Singh]

Hey Mr. Smith, I had a couple of questions for you.
1) What is your general opinion of this trade should it be consummated?
2) What effect do you believe it would have on Andrea's progression? I think moving him to the bench again would severely halt his progression, because as we saw last year, despite the weaker competition he plays awful.

Blogger's note: Again, I'm going to defer answering questions until the morning. Too much other stuff to do.
But check there

[Jaun P]

Hi Doug: I guess the Raptors have to include Graham and Baston and Indiana has to include a player like Diener to make this trade work. Doug:Could you correct If I am wrong, but unless Garbajosa was bought out for less than half salary this O'neal trade would put the Raptors above the luxury cap? Considering the Raptors intend to re-sign Delfino for about 3-millions/season and Roko Ukic is not coming to play to the NBA for less the 2-million/season, this trade would put the Raptors in a very very inflexible budget for the next two season. It looks to me BC is having a hard time selling TJ Ford to the point that he has to make O'neal this deal.

Blogger's note: I wouldn't say they'll do anything of the sort with Delfino for sure. I'll have to look at all the numbers later on just to see where they are near a tax level, remembering that no one knows what it'll be.

[raptor29]

That deal would be sick! I think JO would toughen up everyone in the team kinda like the goon player in a hockey team that intimidates the opponent. Hope he's healthy though as that will give the Raps more of a chance especially against Boston. No need to add the 17 just give them Joey Graham as it may help him develop alongside his twin brother Stephen sort of like a sibling rivalry to get better.

[Paul M.]

Doug, Is this O'Neal trade, in addition to POSSIBLY being a homerun for Colangelo, in any way motivated by cap space questions? Obviously the Raptors take on a big contract for two years...but in addition to shedding Ford, in two years it frees up a lot of cap space, which is good considering Bosh not signing for max years and being an unrestricted FA when the current contract is up. If I recall, Diaw (the only other big trade you've mentioned) has more than two years left on his contract (even if it is for less money).

[Ana]

I'm not so keen on O'Neil suiting up for the Raps, but I am keen on keeping Calderon, and making sure he's a starter this year.

I think Ford is itching to leave the Raptors...and I'm not sad to see him go.