A so-so Raptor debut and wondering what lies ahead today

Happy Trade Deadline Day!

Everyone all nervous and a’twitter?

TONY BOCK/TORONTO STAR

Strange, new, wonderful things happened at small forward for the Raptors last night.

No idea what’s going to happen, I remember sitting around one day waiting for an expected flurry of activity here and league wide and the whole sum of the day’s action was Anthony Johnson going to Orlando from Atlanta in 2000 for a conditional second round draft pick. Yawn. But I also remember standing in a crowded waiting area outside the Raptors offices and getting a call from a guy inside telling me Toronto had done not one, but two substantial deals involving Jerome Williams, Eric Montross and Chris Childs. That was sort of a busy day.

What do I expect today? Far busier than not. I think economics will drive most deals, I think you’ll see at least one significant move by a team with legitimate playoff hopes (Boston with Tony Allen out eight weeks and Orlando with a question mark over Jameer Nelson might be prodded to do something) and it might be a fun day.

Here? Well, it’s really hard to say. Bryan’s got a few things going (“three or four, but nothing close to getting done,” I was told late last night) but watching the energy-free final three quarters of a game in which his team shot a miserable 37 per cent from the field darkened his mood enough to send him right to the phones, I’d imagine.

So keep checking here for updates and news, we’ve got a team of editors (well, one, actually) ready to post ‘em, I’m ready to dissect ‘em the best I can and we’ll do one of those live chats starting about 2 p.m. so we can all be together for the final countdown. Won’t that be sweet?

On to the fun and frivolity:

-

Action: Marion’s debut

Reaction: Not a bad one. Not great, either.

There were flashes, especially in the first seven or eight minutes, when it looked like this deal was going to be a big win.

One play in particular: About three minutes in, Marion grabs a rebound, leads a break and hits Parker with a lob pass for a dunk. Haven’t seen a Raptor small forward do that in years and years.

But another one later underscored the issue on the night: A play across from the Raptor bench, not sure what quarter, and Marion goes across the top to set a screen for Jose, I believe it was. Just before he gets to set it, he slips it, cuts to the basket with pretty much an unimpeded pass but Jose, if it was him, didn’t see the slip coming and didn’t deliver the ball.

Quite understandable since Jamario or Jason or Joey or whoever’s been playing the three slips more on the ice than they ever did on screens but precisely the kind of play teammates with familiarity with each other make.

-

We witnessed history and can be thankful for that.

By tipping a miss and keeping the ball alive, Nate Jawai got his first NBA rebound (an offensive one at that) and then a basket. Two points, one board, 5 1-2 minutes and something to write home about. Priceless.

As one of us beat grunts said, it was the world’s most significant double-single.

-

That being said, we did witness a game in which Jake Voskuhl and Nate Jawai played in the first half of a relatively close game for a team purporting to make a playoff run.

‘Nuff said.

-

Action: Integrating Marion into the flow

Reaction: Another job lies ahead.

Sure, it’s going to take a while for Marion to learn all the intricacies of his new teammates but, conversely, how long is it going to take for Bosh, whenever he comes back, to get used to playing with Marion.

I know Bosh is hurt and I know I’m no doctor and I don’t know his pain threshold but every game that he doesn’t play is one giant step backwards in what has to be a rapid development.

-

What’s Ira up to? Was a pretty big night on his beat, too.

-

This will get the masses chattering, I bet.

Is there a chance the Raptors could make a pitch for Steve Nash this summer? Oh yeah.

According to a nice little NBA salary thing I found in this computer, there is a chance Nash could become a free agent this July. The final year of his deal is not fully guaranteed – if the Suns waive him before July 1 this year they only owe him $7 million – and if money’s so tight and things continue to deteriorate on the court, maybe that’s a way for zany owner Robert Sarver to save some cash.

Now, I’m not suggesting that is going to happen, nor am I suggesting the Raptors would go out and pursue him vigorously if it did, I’m just saying I’m tired of reading about how bad the Raptors are and how dopey I am and this maybe is an alternative “talking point.”

-

Action: Bulls-Kings trade

Reaction: Muted

If you go by the theory the team that "wins" the trade is the one that gets the best player (and I’m not sure you always can), tell me with 100 per cent certainty who is the best player in the trade that sent John Salmons and Brad Miller to Chicago and Drew Gooden, Andres Nocioni and Cedric Simmons to Sacramento (pardon me for leaving out Ike Diogu and Michael Ruffin but they’re Ike Diogu and Michael Ruffin).

Salmons? High volume shooter now has to share shots and minutes with Hinrich, Rose and Gordon

Miller? Aging but okay and doesn't address Chicago's needs for a post scorer

Gooden? What's he done, really?

Nocioni? I wouldn’t ever say he’s a high impact player, a good one in the Garbo kind of way but high impact? Not so much.

I guess you could say Bulls won on talent, Kings won on money.

And in this day and age, money probably counts more.

-

Know what I want? A Tyson Chandler replica Oklahoma City Thunder jersey.

Wasn’t that an odd one. We got a news release from the Hornets about 11 last night saying they were welcoming him back “with open arms.”

Yeah, right.

Imagine how that little dynamic’s gonna play out. Team makes obvious salary dump, gets rid of the one player with the best on-court relationship with the superstar point guard and now has to “welcome him back with open arms” because he was deemed unfit to play for the Thunder?

Glad I’m not Byron Scott having to deal with that mess.

And it’s different from the one time it happened here, too. That was back in February, 2000, when the Celtics said Alvin Williams flunked a physical after they tried to make a deal for Gary Trent. Danny Fortson (how could I have been that stupid).

Of course, that rang a wee bit hollow when Williams went on to play 82 games a year for the next two seasons and 78 the year after that. The thought then, and the thought now, is that Rick Pitino was getting hammered so badly in the media for what everyone thought was a horrible deal for the Celts that they made the physical virtually unpassable.

Now, my bias towards Alvin is very well known but you ask me, who had a better career: Alvin Williams or Gary Trent. Danny Fortson?

-

You’ve got to take the good with the bad, I guess.

The (not so for a day) Mighty Hawthorn Hawks went down to ignominious defeat, I’d sad to report. Whacked 38-15 by the Queenstons yesterday in a game I’m sure was much, much, much than the score would indicate. Or maybe not, I was in the bowels of the Air Canada Centre when it began and no enterprising seventh grader was live-blogging it.

Super Son missed his only field goal attempt with I chalk up to the fact the rims in the road gym were too tight.

But, in the wacky world of elementary school sports, not only do the Hawks make the post-season with a 2-2 record, they host a game against the fourth-place team in a battle for third.

Oh, and then there’s the junior team’s day-long tourney the next day. Guess I do have some good hoops to watch coming up.

-

Comments

[Peter]

It was Danny Fortson, not Gary Trent who was traded for Alvin Williams and Sean Marks in that recinded Boston deal.

Blogger's note: Yeah, fixed. Brain cramp

[Felix Tsui]

i don't want to officially go on the record here, but i'm 90% sure that williams deal with boston was for danny fortson and not gary trent (who might have already been on the raps at that time!)... both similar-type players so easy to confuse, but doug, if you would, check the records cos i think it was fortson!

Blogger's note: I can't believe how stupid I was; yeah, it was Fortson. He's sorta like Trent, though :)

[DF]

Bosh justed tweeted, "I'm back!!!!" - I guess that means that he is expecting to play tomorrow against NY.

[WA]

Doug, although it was against the nail clippers, would you say that Phoenix already fulfilled their promise for a breakneck pace on Tuesday night?

With reaching 100 points in under 30 minutes and shooting 76% at halftime, is it safe to assume Nash was orchestrating a team lay-up line?

Blogger's note: What are they averaging? 141 in two games. Yeah, that's pretty impressive with the oldsters on that roster.

[dp]

...Marion goes across the top to set a screen for Jose, I believe it was. Just before he gets to set it, he slips it, cuts to the basket with pretty much an unimpeded pass but Jose, if it was him, didn’t see the slip coming and didn’t deliver...

I remember seeing this play...it was Jason Kapono not Jose who didn't deliver the pass and instead drew a foul from one of the Cavalier players. If The no-look pass was made to the cutting Marion on the left, we would have seen a highlight dunk.

[Felix Tsui]

"I can't believe how stupid I was"; no need to be so harsh on yourself - happens to us at the best of times!!! A comment like that would just be fueling some the angst of some of your non-believers like sam from yesterday's comment section!!!

and i think the present raps squad could use someone like fortson or trent for their toughness and ability to grab tough rebounds, though perhaps not fortson for his attitude...

[Jake]

Hey Doug,
Is there a standard set by the league for physicals for players in trades? Or is it up to each team's doctor to set the requirements?

Blogger's note: Each team's discretion

[Vincent Lam]

I just read from the NBA transaction section that Damon Stoudamire has been hired as an assistant coach in Memphis. Doug, did you think Damon would eventually become a coach once his playing career was over?

Blogger's note: I knew he was a smart player, but I didn't see coaching in his future this early, no.

[JJ]

Quote: "We got a news release from the Hornets about 11 last night saying they were welcoming him back “with open arms.” "

Doug, just think of the position your arms generally move into when you're shaking your head in disbelief and muttering "What the ... !". Ha, open arms indeed!

[anthony.mackay@gmail.com]

Doug,
Not sure if you can say this so I will... forget Rogers and TSN2 and all this BS. You can watch the raptors games LIVE on the net along with any other game. Last night I watched Raps VS Cavs online and I'm very close to totally canceling my Rogers TV.

To all you real fans out there you can watch with these links, peace !

http://raptorsnation.net/
http://atdhe.net/

[jimmie]

"One play in particular: About three minutes in, Marion grabs a rebound, leads a break and hits Parker with a lob pass for a dunk. Haven’t seen a Raptor small forward do that in years and years."

There were a few of these. It's obviously going to take some time to integrate Marion, but you can clearly see how much his experience playing with Nash has affected his game. He's always making the right cut, looking for a lob, etc. Smart ball player, and you're right, I think Jose just isn't used to playing with a SF like that at all. For all Jamario and Joey's athleticism, they either haven't got the basketball IQ or the experience yet to make those same cuts that are second nature to Marion.

The speed with which this Raptors team can develop that instinctual offensive flow will determine the success of this deal and Marion's future in Toronto past this summer. But even with the bad loss last night, you could definitely see how Marion is a better fit for this team than JO was.

[lukasz]

what did you think of banks out there?

Blogger's note: Tough to say, game was out of hand, but did defend as aggressively as I thought he would.

[Ballantyne]

Do you think Jose can adjust his game to more of a Marion free-wheeling style? Is he really a "safe" point guard or is that just the offensive sequences the raps have been running?

Blogger's note: I think he can adjust just fine.

[Taher]

Did we witness history last night? First Canadian coach tossed from a game? Jay totally lost it last night but can't blame him though--some crazy non-calls and we were down by bunch.

[WA]

I hope the cap falls by just enough that the Raptors have less cap-room than the mid-level so they get to use both. Even the mid-level exception will fall in salary value when the cap does.

Why I want this?

I wouldn't mind using the cap room to resign Parker & Joey or someone that would be an upgrade at the same price along with Joey, then using the mid-level on Marion (if he works out the rest of this season) since he won't be able to command much on the market.

If possible, I'd love to do a 2 for 1 swap getting 2 unproven or undervalued youngsters (or 1 and a vet) for Banks contract.

[Takashi]

Why do Raps Players keep posting up in fast breaks?Every time we have a fast break going Joey,Bargs,JO(When he was here)all run down the court to trie to post up after we get a stop.I said this because i remember one of D'antoni 7 seconds or less rule was that you could not post up after you got a stop because it kill ball movement.

If we want to be a running team do you think they got to cut these post ups?

[Rob]

You know what Doug? Your an idiot. Don't know if your really smart for basketball. Stick to what you know. Nuf said.

Blogger's note: Another satisfied customer! And it's "you're" an idiot and if "you're" really smart for basketball and 'nuff said (an abbreviation of 'enough')
But I'm quite proud that you've taken the time to (a) read and (b) write in to comment.

[SY]

Dear Raps fans out there -

I guess today's the last day I can propose any trade deals, here you go.

Kapono + Parker + (Humpries + 1st @ some later date) for Jefferson (of course, Butler or G.Wallace would be a much better choice).

I am proposing this because it's pretty apparent that Milwaukee is actively shopping Jefferson.

We also need to add two min players to maintain count at 13.

Bosh/Nathan
Bargnani/Jake
Jose/Banks/Ukic/Solomon
Marion/Graham
Jefferson/(2 min players)

Not sure about this year, but the coming years look much more promising.

Sign Rasho for 3 years 5 - 6 million (Most likely)
Sign Parker for 3 years 5 - 6 million (Hopefully)
Re-sign Marion for 3 years, 21 million (Larry-Bird)
Sign Delfino 3 years, 10 million (MLE)

Starting line-up for 2009-2010.

Bosh/Nathan
Bargnani/Nesterovic
Jose/Banks/Ukic
Marion/Delfino/Graham
Jefferson/Parker
+ 1st round

Given the above salary setup, our payroll adds up to around 69 million next year which is really good.

What do you all think?

-SY

[HC]

WA:

Wouldn't need the mid-level on Marion since we can use his bird rights. We can use AP and Joey's bird rights too. So, your hopes are moot and, in fact, we can also use the MLE to sign a different player entirely, including your hoped-for Joey upgrade.

[yertu damkule]

SY - mil. wouldn't be interested, if they move RJ, it'd be a straight salary dump, methinks. latest i've heard is lafrentz for him straight-up. mil. is more concerned with having enough $$ to re-sign sessions & CV this summer. i can't imagine they'd even entertain taking on kapono's unappealing deal...getting nothing in return for RJ (if they do the lafrentz deal) would probably be preferrable (esp. since 80% of what's left is covered by insurance).

can't see either the wiz or bobbies being interested in our pu pu platter for what is arguably each team's respective top (or near top) players.

[RD]

I think it's really funny that people, for instance, SY, take the time to create these trade/signing scenarios, do all the math, type it up and expect comments.

I know it's fun to speculate, but come on people; there are an endless number of scenarios.

Anyhow, I'll give you my thoughts...

You basically have the current roster there (so far 21-35 record). We've yet to see how Marion works out, and you're automatically assuming the the Raptors can resign him. RJ is not coming here. The other roster moves are two guys from the 2007-08 roster (.500 team).

Under the cap? Sure. Make the play-offs? Maybe.

[James]

Doug,

Over the past couple of weeks I have read more and more about the Raptors looking at resigning both Parker and Graham this offseason instead of trying to trade their expiring contracts. No doubt I like both of these players contributions over the course of this season, but resigning these two only adds to the players coming back next year who are the core of a bad team this year. I looked at our contracts for next year and we have 7 players guaranteed to come back with a player option on Jawai. That's 8 players not including Parker and Graham, 10 if they are included.

So come next year we will add at least one new face via the draft, and maybe two new free agents. Hopefully one of the free agents (maybe resigning Marion) will be an impact player, but do you think that will be enough to change the fortunes of this club?

On a side note, I think Marcus Banks will surprise Raptor fans with his perimeter defence and strength. The backcourt has always had a certain degree of athletisism, but I think his strength will earn him some minutes. He is no Messiah, but he will take minutes from Ukic.

Keep up the good work.

James

[Karl]

I hate fantasy trade scenarios. when was the last time one of them actually panned out.

[Felix T]

SY: Honest opinion: I don't think there's a single transaction there that is just incredibly and ridiculously optimistic.
Most fans when proposing these trades (yourself included SY), just look at how good it can be for the raptors and don't really consider why the other team might want to do that deal. You can't just say we want to get rid of 'x' players and in return receive 'y' back. Every deal is not going to be gasol-esque in nature. You have to give up something of value to get back something of value. Don't mean to sound harsh, but it's similar to all fans looking for kapono to get traded for something of value.. but if we don't want him, what makes you think someone else does??

I look forward, just as much as doug is i'm sure, to 3.01 EST to come by so some of these proposed trades will stop... until the offseason, that is.

[Neil]

Can we get a live rolling blog for trade deadline day... would be a lot of "...... still no news...." but might add some comedy. Also, while you are it, live blog the 'waiting around for practice to open'...
Sarcasm and jokes aside thanks for all the great coverage.

Blogger's note: Seeing how it's me, a guy from the Post and a gaggle of RaptorsTV types standing around the concourse at the ACC freezing 'cause the pucks have the temp down to about minus-2391, I don't even think there's comedy to be had.