All trade, all the time

Yeah, so much for a nice afternoon of bad TV and a lovely evening of socializing. Thanks, Bryan. We knew the deal was going to happen, why not wait until Monday to give a grunt a break? But I digress.

And I also have to call an audible around these parts, too.

We’ll do all trade, all the time today and get back in NBA all-star mode in the morning if that’s okay? If it’s not, well, tough bananas.

Here we go:

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Overall

Great trade? No.

Good trade? Absolutely.

Better Raptor team today? I’d take a frontcourt of Bosh-Bargnani-Marion over O’Neal-Bosh-Bargnani any day because everyone now plays their best and normal position.

No one can look me in the eye and say Bargnani isn’t a more effective centre than he is a small forward; no one can look me in the eye and say Marion isn’t a significant upgrade at the three spot.

The bench? Well, there seems to be a growing level of contentment with Joey and Jason of late so that’s good. The backup point guard spot is still an issue but it has been all year.

Up front? They’re thin, no question. But Marion can play a little four, so can Joey and, who knows, Hump’s maybe a month from getting back and maybe he can ease the load a little bit. Perfect? No. But what team is?

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The draft pick

So what?

Seriously, a pick in the mid- to late-teens, or maybe even the low 20s if they have a really good year and not before 2010?

Come on. That’s no big deal at all.

Not only could the $3 million the Raptors got be used to buy a pick in whatever year they need to (and don’t under-estimate the failing economy’s impact on teams wanting money) but Colangelo also has about 14 months to try to acquire one in some trade.

Besides, if they don’t make the playoffs in any single year between now and 2014, Bryan will have been fired so what’s he care for?

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On the court

Minutes after the deal was done, I traded e-mails with Jay and ended my last one by saying I had to go do some work.

His reply?

“So do I.”

Indeed he does. He’s got to find some way to maximize Marion’s talents and there aren’t a lot of plays in the book for the three-man in Toronto’s offence since they never, ever ran anything for Moon.

How Jay handles this acquisition is going to be interesting, he’ll have practices Monday and Tuesday to get Marion fully up to speed with what the Raptors already do and to find some schemes that take advantage of his skills.

Biggest challenge of his young coaching career, you could say.

-

Jermaine’s impact

Look, I thought the guy was really good most nights when he played. Which was, what, about three quarters of the time?

But there’s this:

They’re 21-34 and 14th in a 15-team conference. It’s not like he was Bill Russell or even Cazzie Russell.

Yes, he was tough; yes, he drew charges; yes, he played defence. No, he did not elevate the team to even mediocrity.

-

Jamario’s depature

Good kid, funny guy, a nice fellow to chat with in the locker room.

But, really, as it turned out he was a far better story than he was a player and there was no way in the world I could imagine him coming back next year.

Wish him luck.

-

A wee break here to read what Ira wrote.

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The summer

Yes, the fact Bryan thinks there might only be $10 million available – again given the vagaries of the economy and its impact on the Basketball Related Income that establishes the cap and tax – is a bit of a blow.

It may limit what they can do in trades, as in how much salary they can take on, but if the cap and tax are down for the Raptors, they’re down for everyone and they’ll still be relatively major players in the market.

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The Bosh factor

He’s going to be fine with this trade, trust me. I’m not sure how great Bosh and O’Neal got along on the court – they always needed pretty much the same space – and they weren’t forever hanging out on the road or anything.

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Roko’s minutes

Why are some concerned about Banks “cutting into Roko’s minutes?” Roko doesn’t get minutes when Jose plays anyway. Take away the games that Calderon’s been in and Roko’s averaging about six or seven. I’m pretty sure he’ll still get them.

The Heat will now use the money to pay Bosh in 2010

Miami was going to have cap space to make a run at 2010 free agents regardless of this trade. They would have had enough to make a maximum value offer and they still do.

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Banks contract

Yes, it’s not a great one and having to pay him in 2010-11 will make most – including me – hold their noses.

No, he probably won’t have any impact whatsoever on the court and was in the deal only because the Heat wanted out from under his money.

But, the first time he has 16 and 4, they’ll be nominating him for the Hall of Fame and touching off a Jose-Roko-Marcus debate.

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What’s next

Probably nothing. It goes to what I’ve been writing for days and saying for months, there isn’t a whole lot more the GM can do. I don’t think he should move Parker or Graham because of the combination of their play and their contracts; no way Jose, Bosh or Bargnani go anywhere and there’s no one clamouring for Kapono, I don’t think.

The suspicion here is that the dealing is done and Thursday will be an entirely uneventful day in Raptorland.

Maybe that’s when I’ll get some bad TV and socializing.

Comments

[Carl]

Let's see. We basically traded:
TJ Ford, Rasho Nesterovic, Maceo Baston, Jamario Moon, 2 first round picks, 1 second round pick

for

2-months rental of 12/8 Shawn Marion + bad contract

I love it.

[WSG]

"But, the first time he has 16 and 4, they’ll be nominating him for the Hall of Fame and touching off a Jose-Roko-Marcus debate." THAT was funny.

[Mark M]

Hey Doug

I can't figure out why BC wouldn't want to resign Marion. Any idea?

Blogger's note: He may very well want to and try to in the summer

[Sean Howard]

Call me superstitious, but the fact that this trade took place on Friday the 13th worries me.

[Takashi]

What number will Marion have Dougy?

Blogger's note: No idea at the moment

[G-Rav]

Hey Doug,

thanks for covering the trade and getting us all the info!
i was just wondering, i recall the trade being o'neal for marion and banks because of the salaries and matching and so on. if thats the case, how was moon allowed to be included, or does the "cash consideration" match his salary in a way?

[Dario Passarelli]

Hi there!

I am hearing conflicting reports that Marion is looking for more money next year and some saying he is considering a pay cut. On top of the economic overtones this summer, I have to feel that Marion is not worth his current salary. Will he sign for less if there is some oncourt chemistry this year?

Blogger's note: We'll have to wait 'til the summer to find out

[JLowe]

This whole trade thing really doesn't make sense to me......has there been any admission by BC that JO (in his opinion) was possibly an experiment that failed? Freeing up $3 mill in the cap just doesn't seem worth it to me - there must be something else going on!!! I thought for sure that BC if anything would focus on a backup point guard deal. There were talks about Marion coming to the Raps last year - do we know exactly why they broke down? If a guy like Shawn was what we wanted in the 1st place - why didn't we just wait and try again for a deal this year? I need more to understand this craziness!!!

Confused in Hamilton

Blogger's note: Well, it's a bit more than $3 million in cap space, I think any interest last year was rather unfounded and unsubstantiated and they're quite happy with Parker and/or Ukic as the backup PG right now

[Matt]

Doug I love your sarcasm and the understanding of the Toronto fans. The Jose-Roko-Marcus line is classic.

[Johnson]

I agree with Carl. While this O'Neal trade to Miami may not be so bad, it stinks to high heaven when we consider what we had to give up to get him from Indiana. The loss of first round draft picks may not seem like a big deal to Doug, but imagine if we had never even bothered to get O'Neal and had kept Hibbert along with Ford and Rasho. I'd much rather have Hibbert on a rookie contract than O'Neal at his $20 some odd million and had used Ford to improve where the Raptors had the biggest weakness. Instead Colangelo seemed to believe a team could challenge for the conference title with Jamario Moon, Anthony Parker and Joey Graham playing critical minutes at the 2 and 3.
Did Colangelo confess to any of these massive blunders yesterday or does he believe he's so good at drafting he doesn't even need first round picks, and is so unbelievably charming he thinks that he can recruit several quality free agents needed this summer for peanuts on the dollar?

[Brian Sherman]

Doug, one thing I have not heard any of the critics comment on:

If this trade DIDN'T happen, what would you expect of the Raptors fortunes next season.

Yeah, ugly thought.

[Sal L]

Hey Doug,

What's the background story on Banks? He has a big contract which leads us to believe he was useable at one point in his career. How did he fall to the end of the bench with the Heat?

Blogger's note: Think his talent was simply over-rated when he signed that deal, a very common occurence in the NBA

[brad]

Love the trade - I don't understand why everyone is complaining so much? JO was a great competitor - but he was a 13 and 7 guy right now, it was just a matter of time before there was another controversy with Bosh-JO-Andrea all healthy and playing good. We needed a wing that could play defense, could rebound, take it to the net and create his own offense -- Marion fills 3 or those 4 needs very well. On a straight up deal JO for Marion - Marion is a better fit with the Rap's. Its only a 1st round pick if we DON'T make the playoffs...and we weren't making it this year or anytime soon with JO in the lineup anyway. And although Banks is a bad contract, it allowed us to have cap room this summer to start re-building right away, instead of risking waiting one more year to start making changes and lose Bosh in the process.

The pick hurts a bit...but everything else in the trade is great - besides, if the Rap's are able to buy another pick with the $3m, then its a great trade, not just a good one.

[Mauro]

Sorry, Doug. Its not clear if we are over or under the tax.
Have you worked out all the figures ?
If we are below, that mean we can't use the MLE this summer ?

Blogger's note: It's the cap, not the tax. And whether they are over it or under it will depend on what they do with their various free agents. If they are under the cap by more than the value of the mid-level exception, they do not get it.

[Ivan]

Carl, it's silly to start combining trades and looking back in hindsight. Then you could say:

Miami traded Shaq and $3 mil for JO, Jamario and a 1st Rounder

or even better:

Miami trades Caron Butler, Lamar Odom, Brian Grant and a 2006 1st Rounder (Jordan Farmar) for JO, Jamario and a 1st Rounder.

It's just silly.

[Ivan]

or even sillier:

Villanueva, Rasho, Jamario, Maceo, Hibbert, 1st Rounder
for
Marion, Banks, Jawai, $3mil.

or (since marion and banks were traded for shaq)
Villanueva, Rasho, Jamario, Maceo, Hibbert, 1st Rounder
for
Shaq, Jawai, $3mil

Let's just conclude that combining trades for comparison just doesn't make any sense

[chrisT]

A lot of other Raptor blog sites have this trade as the sign that BC has lost his mind ... that the Raptors will forever be the Clippers ... are people over reacting? Did Riley outplay BC (out wait?)? Doug you seem much more optimistic than others ... why?

Blogger's note: Just read what I've written for two days to see what I think and why. And why other people think the way they do is entirely up to them; I respect their opinions even if I disagree with them.

[PM]

People have gone a little weird talking about how Marion won't work out for us because he's actually better in the 4 spot than the 3. Isn't that kind of the point though? When we've got Andrea stretching the D on offense, don't we need a guy who plays well down low? A guy who does that on offense, while being able to guard every position on D should work out just fine for us. Then again, we were all led to believe O'Neil as an interior presence would make our perimeter D better, and we all know what happened with that.

Still, if it wasn't for the darn conditional first round pick I'd be all over this trade.

[Tom]

Well written. It's this simple: it's a good trade for both teams.
1) They were weak at the 5 and strong at the "big wing" let's call it. We were the opposite with Barg's emergence.
2) We get much financial flex earlier (a good thing) - but that's balances off with a bit less later (Banks)
3) Draft pick and Moon. Not much given up here (get over the draft pick ppl, it's silly) plus we get a little cash. Moon was a free agent anyway. And we have "better Joey" emerging. Kapono is also playing a bit better.

Good trade for Miami as they have a chance to match up better against the elite. Good trade for us as we now have 3 guys playing proper positions - and one heck of a scoring front line. Plus, having financial flex early is key - I certainly agree with Mr. Smith on this point - don't underestimate it's importance.

[Justin]

Open your eyes, this is a terrible trade. BC is incompetent.

[James C.]

We seems to be downplaying the fact that a $4.5MM trade exception was passed on to Miami which reduced the amount of eligible monies available this summer (to $10MM assuming Marion is not resigned). Besides mortgaging the future with a draft pick (who knows it could become a #1 overall in 2015), our brillant!?!??! con-man (sorry, Colangelo) blinked and gave in to desperation. We're not going to win anything substantial with Bosh (too soft) / Barney (wake up he's not going to be a Dirk) / Calderon (a matador on defence and cannot play uptempo - that's why his assist turnover stats are so good). The sooner we blow up the team the better.

[dave]

Doug have you talked to Moon about this deal? JO has made comments about this trade in the past. But I would like to know what Moon thinks of this?

Blogger's note: Haven't got him yet; am told he's quite okay with it, closer to home, thankful of opportunity Raptors gave him, excited to be playing with Wade

[dave]

"Riley said it is possible Moon starts at small forward, calling him, "somewhat of a facsimile of Shawn Marion.""

lol agree Doug?

Blogger's note: I believe Riley may be over-stating things; I firmly believe Miami is going to start Chalmers, Wade, Beasley, Haslem and O'Neal.

[JH]

Can you 100% confirm that we can use the cap space in the summer to sign/trade for other players and then still go over the cap to resign marion?

Blogger's note: No, I can't.

[Brant Bentley]

Doug, a good article here
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/15/magazine/15Battier-t.html?_r=1&ref=magazine&pagewanted=all

What do you think? I think you should ask BC to read it.