Puzzling Numbers

Used to be Blue Jays fans, and the organization, would look fondly back upon the championship years of the early 1990s when packed houses of 50,000 or more were all but guaranteed every night.

These days, the good old days that spawn fond memories seem to be 2007 and 2008, at least from a business standpoint. Average attendance of 29,000-plus seemed to indicate local interest was on the uptick.

Now, it doesn't seem that way.

With a shocking attendance figure of 10,658 from Thursday night, the Jays average attendance for this season has dipped a little further to around the 20,700 mark, a stunning 30 per cent drop over the past three seasons. The last time attendance was this low was way back in 2002 when the team average 20,208 per game.

Baseball in general, of course, is down, and has been for two years. This year it appears the overall figure will reflect a league-wide drop in attendance of about seven per cent, while, the Jays will be down about 10 per cent from last year.

Not good.

The confusing part is that with Paul Beeston back in charge, the disliked J.P. Ricciardi gone, a local boy running the front office and an appealing youth movement, it was expected this would the year GTA baseball fans began to feel more enthusiastic about the team.

Instead, attendance suggests the Jays are less popular now than they were last year, and definitely from three or four years ago.

'Tis a puzzlement.

Wtih Jose Bautista swatting homers at a major league-leading pace, an impressive young pitching staff featuring Brandon Morrow and some exciting prospects on the way, one might have thought there was an opportunity at hand for the Jays to recover some lost ground, not lose more. Generally speaking, local media types have approved of the direction of the team, some suggesting this has been nearly a triumphant season despite a record just about .500. Moreover, its not like any of the other pro teams in town are producing championship-quality teams.

So what's the reason behind the drop? Well, the stadium, of course. The Rogers TV issues haven't helped. Having a caretaker manager doesn't exactly get the masses excited. And, as has been the case for a long, long time, no meaningful games in August, let alone September, kills interest. Playing in the tough American League East continues to be an issue, although another competitive season from low payroll Tampa Bay is gradually taking away the division in which the Jays play as a meaningful excuse.

The season began with some shockingly low numbers, but then there was some recovery. Now, it seems the season may end on a low, which has to leave the Jays thoroughly puzzled as to what it will take - if anything - to bring the people back.

Comments

[Rogersblows]

I agree with the Rogers sediment. I live in Chicago now, my parents still in TO, and I cant believe what this company does/charges to its customers. They pay $25.99 for an HD DVR (or PVR). I pay $7.99 for a much better DVR. Their customer service is atrocious! Anything with that big red sign on it is doomed to fail. It would be interesting to analyze attendance records prior to Rogers buying naming rights to the stadium. I bet it was statistically higher before. Old man Rogers needs to invest heavily in Customer service and put some of his billions to work on a new lakefront stadium. Then don't let talent walk out the door in its prime. For a guy worth what, $15 Billion, he sure doesn't spend it like he earns it. The Jays are starting to resemble the Expos of the 90's, and we all know what happend to them!

[DougG]

I used to go all the time but gave up because of the constant losing. The same thing happened with the Maple Leafs and it looks like the Raptors are next. This city doesn't deserve the incompetence we are subjected to, decade after decade.

[Werner]

Unfortunately, it's a chicken-and-egg scenario.
"When are you coming back?" the team asks. "When you start winning!" the fans say.
It's not cheap to go out either. It's a 150 dollar night for two (decent) tickets, and a beer and a dog is 20 bucks???
And lastly, this is a lazy, sit-on-my-ass-and-watch-it-on-TV generation.

[John]

Value, over priced tickets and concessions, why would anyone want to go? I have watched and attended games annually since the old Exhibition Stadium days. However last year I took my family of 4 which cost $200 for so-so tickets in the outfield and concessions cost me a bundle more, imagine $10.50 for a beer and almost $20 for 2 hotdogs and 2 fountain pop. Unless ticket prices come down and concessions become reasonable, I won't be going back regardless of how well the Jays are doing. The value is not there in bringing your family and attending a game. Unless, something is done to make attending economical, then a whole generation of kids will not be exposed and there goes the future.

[keikocat]

We were insanely rabid Jays fans until the '94 strike. That killed our interest in baseball dead. Totally. At that point we gave up our share in a season ticket package, and decided we were done with the sport. We stopped watching it on TV. Now, maybe once or twice a season, I'll turn to a game, marvel at all the empty seats, and wonder how Major Leage Baseball can continue to pay even the batboy's salary.

[Mary K]

I was there for game 7 in 1993 and I would love to be there for another game 7 - with my son. However, the stadium is an absolute dump - dark, dirty and depressing. The food is disgusting and hideously expensive. In addition, on the 5th deck, they have 2 beer stations for every food station, clearly not family friendly. The "good" food is on the 2nd level but the cost of your day is even more hideously expensive if you can manage to sit on that level. Finally, the Leafs draw 18,000 fans / game for 42 games and the fan support is golden. The Jays draw 20,000 fans / game for 82 games and the team lacks fan support. Hello, do the math. What # would make the Jays fan support golden? And finally, I can make it home at my usual time to catch the start of the game, make / eat dinner, clean up / do laundry, etc, etc, all while watching the game and be in bed at a decent hour. Why would I go to the stadium?

[kev.]

baseball is dead in canada forever. ever since they shut down the 1994 season just to prevent a toronto-montreal world series, and then sent Loria up to steal the expos and move them to montreal. there's the conspiracy that no one in the media speaks of, yet every true canadian fan is aware of. do the research yourself...at the time of the '94 strike, the jays were on the road to a three-peat, and the expos had their best season ever, and had the best record in the entire MLB. for some reason after the '94 season, the whole team was dismantled, and Jeff Loria took over the team with MLB assistance. MLB used a fantasy called "contraction" in which it claimed the league needed to shed the Expos, and Minnesota Twins, to become more economically resilliant, but alas, at last minute the Twins were spared. furthermore, no actual contraction ever occured, as the Expos were moved to Washington, and that is hardly contraction.

[James]

How can anyone be surprised that a team which hasn’t entered September within 5 games of a playoff spot for the best part of 2 decades, enters August with a double digit deficit and the crowds aren’t coming? You have a generation of residents in Toronto that haven’t even had a glimpse of a pennant race and consequently aren’t fans. I’m told that the Jays are rebuilding however rebuilding normally comes after a high. Where was the high exactly? Highs in the AL East come either courtesy of a $150 to $220 million payroll or a decade of 60 win seasons giving you enough prospects to compete for a few years before your best players end up in pinstripes.

Following the Jays is like following the Washington Generals. You’re there to lose.

[S-Dot]

You've misquoted Al Davis, its "Just Win, Babby!", but nevertheless I don't think having a winning team is the only problem.

I grew up in Toronto and have very fond memories of taking in games at the Ex. I even have a pair of Exhbition Stadium seats mounted near my front door in my home. But when they moved to the SkyDome they sealed their long term fate. That boondoggle white elephant (literally) is a masoleum when it isn't at least half filled. We all got smokescreened into wanting the latest in technology with the retractable roof. As another writer said, the first nail in the coffin came with Camden Yards in Baltimore.

I live near San Francisco now and greatly enjoy taking in both Giants and A's games. Both are vastly different experiences, but the atmosphere in both places is far better than in the Dome, especially in San Francisco.

I have been to about 3/4 of the MLB parks and while the "retro look" is indeed becoming cookie cutter, all of these places are alive on game day. The SkyDome has no charm and none of the experience of that visceral connection to the outdoor elements. I make it home to a Jays game about once a year and its become a sad state.

They tried to make it seem like less of a concrete jail with all the blue they've added inside, but its not working. Its time to call the Dome what it is. The Mistake by the Lake II. The roof was never needed, we lost all character that Toronto had. The place is too big too. The average ballpark these days holds about 40,000, making it seem more intimate. Whomever designed the SkyDome was never a baseball fan. The seats slope back too gently, leaving the second deck and above too far from the game.

Even the Minnesota Twins are making it work with an open air stadium, and they are leading their division, once again. The newly rechristened Miami Marlins will be in a new futuristic looking home in a couple years. Its only a matter of time before Oakland moves to San Jose into a brand new park funded by Silicon Valley. This will leave only Toronto and Tampa Bay with the dumpiest parks in the league. Tampa Bay is quickly coming to judgement day over their stadium situation with the second best team in the majors, and no one in the seats.

It remains to be seen what will happen with Toronto. When will Rogers see what really needs to happen to bring people back to baseball. Oh save us Fergie Olver and Don Chevrier!!!!

Build a new ballpark in a neighbourhood that will bustle with its existence, with better amenities and better transit connections and the people will come.

[rob]

What is so puzzling. I went to games, then along came Sportsnet 1. Now, when I go out, I go somewhere else.

[nick]

The security staff takes the fun out of the game. They make sure you only have "X" amount of beers or they will cut you off; you are not allowed to go out for a smoke at Rogers Centre but you can at the ACC during leaf games; they follow you around to make sure you are sitting in your seats/section and the food is lousy!! The experience just isn't fun anymore. The team is great to watch but I wan't to get hammered and go for a smoke but I'm not allowed. That's why I still go to leaf games because MLSE knows that simple things like butts and booze put people in stadiums even if the team is horrible.....

[D'Arcy]

The Dome isn't great, but what's worse is the in-game atmosphere. Try going early to watch BP. Man, the loud and lousy music piping through the cavern is extremely annoying, and during the game, it is non-stop. Every bit of non-action time is crammed with loud music. You can't really even have a conversation with anybody, and baseball is a game you talk about while it is on. It finally turned me right off, and I decided to spend my time and money somewhere less crass.

[Joseph]

who wants to 10+ for a beer? @#$% Rogers.

[Ray b]

Some of these comments are quite uproarious..Most people in Toronto would gladly pay 150+ bucks for a ticket, 10 bucks for a beer and pay money for leafstv to watch the leafs but then compain about the cost of a baseball game..It doesn't cost a lot to watch a game at a wonderful stadium like the Rogers Center..Do most of you realize you can bring your own snacks to the game?..Sure just hit the dollar store grab your kids' fav snacks, pack up the cooler and hit a game for about 35 bucks a seat and 10 bucks for parking..Thats all it will cost you..Heck even if you grab a few beers it is still a cheap night out..You can bring a family of 4 to a game with very good seats for under 150 bucks..Try that at a Leaf game..Good luck..This isn't really a baseball town but for those of us who actually follow the game and the team, its a joke to listen to some of these comments and read articles from journalists who really don't know much about the sport..Mr. Cox you should stick to hockey..Baseball isn't your thing..

[Bruce]

I stopped going last year - used to get the 15 game flex pack. Won't go back until Gaston is gone for good. Too aggravating to watch Kevin Millar and his .212 BA and his .320 OBP bat 4th 57 games because he's a veteran and veterans play ahead of young guys hitting over .300 like Lind and Hill were. Or Tallet gas one up because the manager likes the cut of his jib.

Maybe next year....

[Joe Eros]

Rogers has shit the bed and wonder why nobody will sleep with them.
Unbelievable!

[R.J. MacLean]

I can tell you one reason: the cost of going to the game. I am not referring to the ticket price...there is a range of prices and the cost of tickets is understandable. I refer to the costs of a beer or pop, a bag of chips or peanuts, a hot dog or a slice of pizza. These prices are just beyond reason. If I'm going myself, then fine...but if i want to take my wife and daughter...for a family it just becomes ridiculous. I would bet that if they halved the prices of the concessions, they would see a significant increase in prices.

[Matt Pellar]

Jays need a chance - Their division is too tough! Seats and concessions are way to expensive. $12.00 for 1 beer. Lets face it, beer and baseball go hand in hand, It's a 4 hour game.... at a beer an hour, that's $48.00 for four beers. This is why the TV ratings are still doing well, people are just staying home, and having as much, if not, more fun for less.

[DamienCox]

Damien here. . .one of the most frequent comments here has been from fans who believe they can't have a good time because security won't let them behave - cheer, drink - as much as they would like to. I get that. On the other hand, the last two times I went with my son, we were sitting near people who were drinking far in excess to the point they started fighting. That was after two hours of listen to them swearing loudly thinking they were funny. I'd bet more people are turned off by the behavior of drunken lots than those who find the security oppressive to the point of killing the fun. Maybe if I went with my buddies instead of my children I'd feel differently.

[Keith Ruttan]

The Skydome {I refuse to call it the Rogers Centre} is a horrible venue. Food prices are outrageous and the quality is poor. As always, the problems in an organization begin and end with ownership. The greed of Roger's is evident in the SNET1 situation and this puts the fans off. Rogers may better than Interbrew but not by much. Leaf fans have been rewarding mediocrity since I was a teenager. Rogers seems to be hoping the trend will be extended to the Jays.True fans will have patience with a team that is re-building.They understand shutting down a young pitcher-No true fan would want to see the hope for the future injured like the wonderchild from the Nationals was this year. BTW-Cito deserves no blame. He is the best manager the Jays has ever had-including Bobby Cox and Jimy Williams.

[K. Lee]

I'm dying to comeback. However, when your take home pay is reduced by $1000 a month. Cuts and changes take priority. My kids activities come first. Bills to pay and other extras are now prioritized by my wife and I. My pay is reduced and it is getting harder to take multi million dollar contracts for a kids game. Sports are a release but it adds up quickly to get a quality seat. I used to be a season ticket holder for the Jays. Pro sports is close to being out of our price point. Leafs for sure, Raptors are useless, the Jays are still within reach. However, Sportsnet 1 really pissed me off. Argos and Ticats are the best deals out there. Forget the NFL as well. A lot of people are still being hit by the economics of today.

[RJ]

Problem with the Jays is that the atmosphere stinks and everything is overpriced. They want to get rid of the yahoos, but those yahoos are dropping insane amounts of money on 12 dollar beers. Do those at Wrigley ban drinking yahoos? No they freakin tailgate before, during and after games! If you want it family friendly drop prices in the lower deck, if you want good atmosphere lower prices and better food and beer variety! Build attractions within the dome, new bars/restaurants not generic stands (Burkie's doghouse anyone?) Put in statues of blue jays greats, build a darn atmosphere instead of a corporate image as bland as the concrete. Make your own sausage mascot race. Do anything! The only fun thing that I got out of it was telling the opposing relief pitcher to "Run Forrest Run!" as he sprinted to the mound. My fellow fans laughed and so did the guy's teammates. Make baseball fun again!

[1967PontiacGTO]

No one can be surprised that an enterprise run by Rogers is failing, as it seems they can only succeed if they have a pseudo-monopoly situation. Beyond that, watching a game at Skydome is like watching a game in an underground parking garage. I go to a game whenever I'm in Boston, New York, Chicago or Philadelphia, because it's fun just to go and be at a game. In Toronto, it's like sitting in a concrete toilet. And the concessions are crap, as well. And the team has ZERO chance of advancing to the playoffs. The Leafs can get away with mediocrity. The Jays can't, which is actually a good thing.

[Russ]

B J 's are again mediocre. THEY LUCKED OUT WITH BAUTISTA; OTHERWISE THEY'D BE UNDER .500 THIS YEAR.
There is no sign they'll ever be better than .500 +/_ .025.
Why go to watch this annually repeated charade?

[F Crockett]

Step One: Turn the Sportsnet One Braintrust over to Pastor Terry Jones in Florida for continuing strategic advice on the performance of organizational suicide.